Updates on the Fight for Quality Public Education in Brevard County, FL
0:00 (upbeat music)
0:30 (upbeat music continues)
7:16 (gavel bangs)
7:17 - Good morning.
7:18 The January 24th, 2023 board work session is now in order.
7:22 Paul, please call the roll.
7:23 - Mr. Susan.
7:24 - Here.
7:25 - Ms. Wright.
7:26 - Here.
7:27 - Ms. Jenkins.
7:28 - Here.
7:29 - Ms. Campbell.
7:29 - Here.
7:30 - Mr. Trent.
7:31 - Here.
7:32 - Please stand for the pledge of allegiance.
7:35 - I pledge allegiance to the flag
7:37 of the United States of America
7:39 and to the Republic for which it stands,
7:42 one nation, under God, indivisible,
7:45 with liberty and justice for all.
7:50 - Before we begin, I want to acknowledge
7:51 that this is a schedule to be a long meeting.
7:53 Therefore, it will be stopped around noon
7:55 for a one hour lunch break so that board staff
7:57 and the public attending can refresh
7:58 and be ready to return to the conversations.
8:00 Now we’ll begin our first topic,
8:02 which is discipline followup.
8:03 I’m gonna give the floor to Dr. Schiller to start it off
8:06 as he has some of his recommendations.
8:08 Dr. Schiller, you have the floor.
8:10 - Thank you, Mr. Susan, and good morning.
8:13 Thank you, Mr. Susan, and good morning board members.
8:15 Very nice to be here on my maiden voyage
8:18 of the first board meeting.
8:22 One of the issues that came up, obviously, at our retreat
8:25 was the extent to which where do we stand
8:28 with all the matter that we could put
8:30 under the umbrella called board issues regarding discipline.
8:35 And I would like to kind of go through
8:38 where we are to this date.
8:40 Staff has worked overtime in reading me in,
8:43 and also I’d like to share with you
8:46 how I could propose to the board we go forward
8:50 in order to try to bring, I believe we can successfully
8:53 bring to resolution for the board
8:56 and all the actions that the board would like to take,
8:58 and that would satisfy most of the needs, if not all,
9:02 prior to the assumption of duties
9:05 by your permanent superintendent.
9:07 And so I’d like to, if I could, have the time,
9:11 ladies and gentlemen, to go through.
9:15 There are a number of features and factors
9:17 and moving pieces that we’re dealing with
9:19 under this omnibus of discipline issues.
9:23 You originally received a memorandum
9:25 from Deputy Superintendent Thede,
9:29 as well as Mr. Gibbs, back in middle, early December
9:35 as a result of the board meeting in early December,
9:39 at which time they had explained that the actual policies
9:44 and administrative regulations that were in effect,
9:48 remained in effect, and these policies
9:51 and administrative regulations would be in effect
9:54 and implemented as they are until such time
9:57 that the board took action to change any of the policies.
10:02 If indeed you want to stop at any time
10:04 to get verification from Mr. Gibbs or whatever,
10:08 Mr. Thede, of course, Dr. Thede is not here,
10:11 but you have a copy of that letter.
10:13 So in effect, the board policies in your policy book,
10:19 and in the board manual, your 500 series of student conduct,
10:26 removal of out-of-school suspension,
10:28 disciplinary placement, expulsion of students,
10:31 and the cell phone policy, wireless communications,
10:37 are all standard and in effect.
10:41 The administrative regulations are updated every year.
10:46 In fact, starting with, I can’t recall the date,
10:51 with Dr. Blackburn, who was a former superintendent here,
10:55 there is a whole booklet that goes out in each year
10:58 based on federal and state statutes and changes.
11:02 That’s updated.
11:04 The last update was a revision on July of 2022,
11:11 and that was brought before the former board.
11:14 And that’s what’s been controlling.
11:16 And every year, there’s an effort to upgrade that,
11:20 bring it out to the staff, to the board.
11:23 So one of the things that we’ll be talking about next
11:25 will be the policy book and the administrative regulations.
11:30 The regulations and policy that you have here
11:34 with regard to administrative regulations,
11:36 of course, you know, administrative regulations
11:38 are intended to bring clarity and direction
11:41 and to the staff, the implementation of the policies.
11:46 There’s not been a generalized practice here.
11:48 And if you look at the policy book,
11:49 you look at the administrative regulations,
11:51 it’s kind of thin.
11:53 One of the things I’m gonna ask you to consider
11:56 going forward, if the board wishes,
11:58 as they go through the bylaws and the policies,
12:00 if you want the administrative regulations regularly,
12:04 as many boards do, brought to you
12:06 to make sure they’re in alignment with the policy
12:09 for implementation.
12:11 One of the issues that we’re,
12:12 so that’s a question that we’ll have at the next session
12:14 about review of policies and whether or not,
12:18 just for alignment, does this board wish to now
12:21 have the administrative regulations that are in the province
12:24 of being drafted by your superintendent historically,
12:27 but they’ve not necessarily come back to the board
12:30 for your review and approval.
12:33 And, but at this point in time, I just want to reiterate
12:39 that these policies are in effect
12:43 and the administrative regulations and all of the updates
12:46 that the staff get from the state and the federal government
12:50 that’s what is the action that’s taking place.
12:53 It also leads to some kind of inconsistent application
12:59 at the school-based level, not by neglect,
13:02 not by intention, but it really is pretty much predicated
13:08 on the fact that there is some variation and case by case,
13:12 we have our principals doing some interpretation.
13:16 Now, as a side light to it, one of the needs
13:18 that we need to address, as our staff will explain
13:22 as they’ve told me, is that there’s a little bit
13:26 of a disconnect between what is required by the statute
13:33 what is required by the board policies
13:37 and how that is then translated into the adequate training.
13:42 And that’s due to lack of time and resources
13:45 that staff may have, that we’re able to take
13:48 what’s happening and to help our principals
13:51 and our teachers fully understand the implementation.
13:55 Now, that’s something that senior staff and I
13:57 have been talking about particularly yesterday
13:59 at great length of time, and it’s not a function
14:03 of not doing, it’s a function that there has not
14:06 been adequate time or maybe resources
14:08 to be able to do the kind of in-service training,
14:11 particularly at the start of the school year before school,
14:15 so that everyone understands the clarity
14:18 of what’s being expected.
14:19 So that is a budgetary issue, it’s an issue that,
14:24 as your policy indicates, that the superintendent
14:27 is responsible along with staff to address
14:30 collective bargaining, and in working with our leadership,
14:33 they would like for the time that I’m here,
14:36 at least to do the language, bring it to the board
14:39 of the proposals and different needs that the board has
14:42 and what those folks have in representing
14:45 their constituencies and stakeholders.
14:48 And of course, the fiscal side of the collective bargaining
14:52 would be handled after I would leave in June one,
14:55 and when the state knows the funding.
14:57 So what we’re trying to do is to kind of lay out
15:00 a couple of things, one, we know what now is existent,
15:06 we know, and Paul, Mr. Gibbs can then bring clarity
15:09 to that should you wish now, staff has worked diligently
15:14 to try to adhere to the board’s policies and regulations,
15:19 and it’s just a matter now of bringing it all together,
15:22 at least for that side, we can’t expect staff
15:25 to administer consistently, if indeed,
15:28 that there’s a dichotomy between what this board’s expecting
15:33 and what’s happening at the schools.
15:35 I believe in my judgment after going through all this,
15:37 being briefed by Dr. Theti, being briefed
15:41 by former assistant superintendent Moore, by Paul,
15:45 by our good staff, that people are doing
15:50 in the framework of what’s there.
15:53 And it’s at variance with what the board wishes,
15:55 I think the board will have to then address
15:57 these particular policies, and then the administrative regs
16:01 would be so revised within the context of the requirements
16:05 at the state and federal level, which is causing some issues.
16:10 So that’s the number one thing I want to talk about
16:12 as where we are today, and where perhaps, chairman,
16:17 the direction of the board would be with regard
16:19 to starting from the policies, those policies
16:24 that are existent, that you review,
16:26 and wish to have change on the majority of the board vote,
16:30 or a full board vote, I should say,
16:32 and also then the alignment of the administrative regs.
16:35 And if we can get this all done, we can get that into effect
16:38 as soon as everything lines up, but certainly must be done
16:42 before the start of next school year,
16:45 so the adequate training and service and explanation
16:49 should be done for the community, for stakeholders,
16:52 and as importantly, our administrators.
16:54 Now, if I’ve left anything out, just help me, staff,
16:58 if indeed there’s anything you would like for me to augment.
17:06 All right, I would also point out is that our staff,
17:09 I mean, the amount of experience that we have in the staff
17:13 is something I’ve never had the pleasure of working with.
17:17 The amount of knowledge and the amount of loyalty
17:20 to BPS is just astounding.
17:23 It really is, from my five-decade experience.
17:27 The bottom line is that they follow what it is
17:30 that you as a policy board deem as the direction,
17:35 and that former boards have deemed as direction.
17:38 The administrative regulations has had been written,
17:41 starting, and therefore, if we can find and identify
17:46 some of the variances and some of the ways to remedy it,
17:49 we would.
17:49 Let me pause here for any clarifications up to this point.
17:53 - Thank you, Dr. Shiller.
17:54 So let me get this straight.
17:55 Basically, our staff followed our discipline policies
17:59 and administrative procedures that were passed by the board,
18:03 and you feel that if there’s any discrepancies,
18:06 you’d like us to bring it forward and bring those up today.
18:09 That’s the first of these–
18:11 - And to proceed with the appropriate changes
18:15 to the policies that reflect this board,
18:17 so then we would then rewrite the administrative regs
18:20 to make sure they’re in alliance,
18:22 and then regenerate that,
18:26 and then go through the training and service session
18:28 so everyone understands.
18:29 Again, there’s a moving field of federal regulations
18:34 in Title IX that’s been recently changed.
18:37 There’s a moving aspect.
18:38 We’re constantly getting updates from the state.
18:42 So there’s a balance there, sir.
18:43 - Thank you.
18:44 So basically, you have one, two, three things
18:47 that you were mentioned inside your discipline issues
18:49 and matters that you brought forward.
18:50 This is kind of purpose.
18:52 This is where you’re talking.
18:53 The next one is established steering committee.
18:55 The next one is RSM audit,
18:58 and then draft for the steering committee.
19:00 I think those are four issues.
19:02 I wanted to give you the opportunity.
19:03 Did you want to stay on number one for the first time?
19:05 - If you wish, you tell me, sir,
19:07 if you want to pause here or I can go forward.
19:09 - I always like following up with just one item
19:11 so that we can move through it and stuff like that.
19:12 - Yes, we’re right on time with that.
19:13 - Sure.
19:14 Okay, so basically now we’re going to have discussion
19:17 based on the discipline that we were talking about.
19:20 So Dr. Schiller says that he met with staff
19:23 and that they came forward with,
19:24 that they have been following the policies
19:26 and the administrative procedures that we have passed.
19:29 Is there any discussion?
19:30 I’ll go to Ms. Jenkins.
19:38 - Yeah.
19:44 Dr. Schiller, thank you for highlighting
19:49 that all of the supposed concerns
19:52 that were highlighted recently are addressed
19:56 in our policies that our administrative procedures
19:59 are addressing those,
20:00 that our staff has the intentions to follow those.
20:03 And if they’re not being followed,
20:05 that it’s not due to neglect.
20:07 I appreciate that very much.
20:15 I’m so tired of having this conversation.
20:18 And so I’m going to take this opportunity
20:20 to say what I need to say so I can relinquish myself
20:24 from this conversation going forward.
20:32 I feel like over the past two months,
20:34 we’ve participated in a circus.
20:35 I feel like we’ve done damage to this district,
20:38 to our staff, to our students,
20:40 to cause fragments within the business community
20:43 because of the perception that we put out into the community.
20:48 And I felt like I knew why it was happening,
20:53 but I really wanted to know why.
20:55 And so I questioned it.
20:57 And of course, I don’t get a response
21:00 to some of my questions,
21:01 but I did from the Brevard County Sheriff’s Office.
21:05 I questioned how that video came to be
21:10 and got some interesting responses.
21:13 I was actually shocked by how much they responded.
21:19 Again, I can’t talk about these things
21:21 outside of the sunshine.
21:23 I didn’t get this stuff until, I think, December 29th.
21:26 And you all are aware I had bigger things to talk about
21:29 on January 9th than to talk about this.
21:31 So if you’re wondering why I’m talking about it now.
21:33 Also, we put discipline on the agenda again,
21:35 so I’m talking about it.
21:38 I’m frustrated.
21:39 I’m frustrated that we were forced
21:40 to participate in the circus.
21:41 I’m frustrated that our staff and our students
21:44 and our community was basically a casualty
21:46 in this conversation.
21:47 And we are here today saying,
21:50 yeah, we’ve got these policies in place
21:52 and these procedures in place.
21:53 And sure, we can always improve and clean up,
21:56 but there’s nothing major that we’ve made changes to.
22:01 I received,
22:08 I guess a letter, I’d call it,
22:11 that Mr. Ivey had drafted back in August.
22:15 And it started off with Chairperson Blank.
22:18 And this letter was emailed to Mr. Susan
22:22 the morning of November 22nd,
22:24 the day that our two new board members were sworn in.
22:27 And the letter was concerning discipline.
22:32 And it basically was asking the school board,
22:35 again, it wasn’t addressed to anybody yet,
22:37 said Chairperson Blank, to take a look at our wireless
22:41 communication device policy and considering
22:46 increasing the,
22:51 increasing the discipline for students
22:53 who are using their cell phones to record students
22:57 who are being bullied or harassed
22:59 and putting it on social media,
23:00 which is a pretty reasonable request.
23:03 He was specifically asking us to follow Polk County’s policy.
23:08 That same policy was also sent to Mr. Susan
23:11 the morning of November 22nd.
23:14 It was attached to the email.
23:15 I have it here in case anyone wants to question
23:17 the validity of that.
23:21 They also gave me their phone calls
23:23 in which two were made that evening
23:24 during the board meeting to Mr. Susan.
23:26 One went to call waiting.
23:27 One was received during a recess of our meeting.
23:30 And then when we came back from the recess
23:32 is when my fellow board member who’s been here
23:35 for six years went on to pontificate
23:38 about the discipline issues in our schools.
23:43 I then received text messages that made it very clear
23:48 that this was not just something initiated by Mr. Ivey,
23:53 that it was a group communication with the union,
23:57 Mr. Susan and Mr. Ivey to organize this conversation.
24:02 Why this frustrates me is because when we came
24:05 into the meeting on December, I think it was eighth or ninth
24:08 and you all can confirm this.
24:11 We never heard anything in that video or from Mr. Susan
24:14 about what we were gonna actually talk about that day.
24:16 Ms. Campbell actually sent an email asking specifically
24:19 what policies we were gonna discuss that day.
24:20 We didn’t get any followup.
24:22 And when we came in in the folder
24:24 was the wireless communication device policy
24:26 that we never discussed, was never brought to our attention.
24:30 And if you recall at the end of that meeting,
24:32 after talking about significant behaviors,
24:35 we started talking about wireless communication devices
24:38 out of nowhere.
24:40 The following board meeting in our folder,
24:44 again, was solely the wireless communication device policy.
24:49 Why does this frustrate me?
24:51 Because this request that clearly someone was aware of
24:56 is not a crazy request to have a conversation
24:59 about how do we discipline students
25:01 when they’re filming others getting bullied or harassed
25:03 and putting it on social media.
25:04 That’s a really rational request.
25:06 But we didn’t have that conversation.
25:08 Instead, we put on a show.
25:10 We put on a circus.
25:12 We gathered members of the community.
25:14 We concerned them.
25:15 We concerned the business community.
25:17 They’re very, very concerned about how we look
25:20 to the rest of this nation because of the coverage
25:24 on these conversations.
25:28 It bothers me.
25:29 I feel like I’ve been taken along on a circus
25:32 for no reason, one that I, quite frankly,
25:35 don’t want a ticket to any longer.
25:37 It is self-serving and it is foolish.
25:40 It doesn’t benefit our students.
25:42 It doesn’t benefit our staff
25:43 because here we are two months later
25:44 and we aren’t making any changes.
25:46 We haven’t made any change.
25:48 And quite frankly, again, the one that was requested,
25:51 if it doesn’t exist here already,
25:54 we could have a conversation about
25:56 and make a difference for our students and our staff.
25:58 And we haven’t had that conversation.
26:00 And that’s so frustrating to me.
26:02 And the reason I’m putting this out in the air
26:04 is ‘cause, yes, I received it
26:06 and I can’t do it any other way except in the sunshine.
26:08 But quite frankly, I want a ticket off of this crazy train.
26:11 I want nothing to do with this.
26:13 If we are gonna have real conversations
26:15 about the problems in our schools,
26:16 I will absolutely participate.
26:18 I wanna support our students and our staff.
26:20 If you wanna talk about the physical aggression
26:23 that we hear about, but if you wanna have
26:25 a real honest conversation and acknowledge the data,
26:27 the data that those things are happening
26:29 in our ESC classrooms, talk about how we can provide
26:32 better environments for our ESC students,
26:34 provide better resources for those students and teachers
26:36 to provide safer environments
26:38 and to actually meet their needs, I’m here for it.
26:43 But to pretend that our general education students
26:45 are beating up our teachers every day,
26:47 I’m not having that conversation any longer
26:50 because it’s just false.
26:52 It makes me sick to my stomach that I had to sit in a room
26:56 and watch TV while we have staff members
26:58 talking about getting physically abused by students
27:05 to find out those students are blind
27:07 and cognitively impaired.
27:10 And we are painting a picture that our classrooms
27:13 are wildly out of control when we really should be having
27:16 a very specific conversation to help our kids.
27:23 I’m frustrated and I appreciate Dr. Schiller
27:26 starting off by saying, these policies already exist,
27:30 these procedures already exist,
27:32 how can we improve the implementation of them
27:35 on our campuses?
27:37 That’s the conversation we should be having.
27:39 We shouldn’t be shaming our kids,
27:41 we shouldn’t be shaming our staff
27:43 and we shouldn’t be degrading the wonderful district
27:45 that we work in.
27:49 And so from this point forward,
27:51 if we aren’t gonna talk about actual change and progress,
27:54 please do not call on me
27:56 ‘cause I really no longer want to participate in this show.
28:00 I am not campaigning for someone’s future.
28:03 Thank you.
28:04 - Ms. Jenkins, you said you have copies of these things,
28:08 can you provide those to us?
28:09 - I can, they’re right here.
28:10 - And if you can, do you have copies for everybody
28:13 or do you need Mrs. Aguirre to make the copies?
28:17 - I can absolutely ask her to do that for me.
28:18 - I’m checking my email and I don’t have an email
28:21 from Sheriff Ivey on the 22nd.
28:26 I’ll take a look at what you have
28:27 and cross-reference it. - You did not receive it
28:28 from Sheriff Ivey,
28:29 you just received it from Brevard County Sheriff’s Officer.
28:33 - Our security, I have one email in here that’s,
28:36 well, I guess we’ll get to the public records.
28:38 - Mr. Susan, I have it on, I have it in print.
28:40 - Yep, we’ll see, all right.
28:42 Okay, Ms. Campbell, you have something to say?
28:46 - Yes, I will just address
28:48 what Dr. Schiller suggested he would like
28:51 to have some consensus on, a couple of things.
28:54 One, yes, if it’s normal practice outside of our district
29:02 and other districts across the state and the nation
29:04 for the boards to approve administrative,
29:06 and you keep saying regulations,
29:07 for us it’s administrative procedures, same thing.
29:10 I think that’s great,
29:12 there’s certainly been plenty of conversations
29:14 where I’ve had community members ask me a question
29:15 and I say, well, that’s not policy,
29:17 that’s administrative procedure, it would be good
29:18 just to have our eyes on that.
29:21 Right, exactly, I’m all for that.
29:24 I think it would be good for them just to come through us
29:28 because ultimately we are hold accountable for those.
29:33 I absolutely agree with additional training,
29:35 I absolutely agree that we need to make that part
29:38 of the collective bargaining conversation.
29:40 I have, I’ve said it before, but I think we need
29:43 to not give up any more professional development time
29:46 because the people that we usually hear the most pushback
29:50 on professional development time are those who are,
29:53 have been teachers for a long time
29:55 or have a certain level of expertise.
29:57 I just rode a bus with one on a field trip the other day
30:00 and she said, I don’t have a problem
30:02 with classroom discipline.
30:03 I’m like, well, she’s been teaching for some time
30:04 and had that training.
30:06 However, we have a growing number of teachers
30:08 who are very young, very new,
30:11 did not come out of an education background.
30:13 And I will tell you, having a education degree,
30:19 I had one semester of classroom management
30:22 and then I got thrown out into student teaching,
30:25 which we call internships now.
30:26 And I will tell you as a student teacher,
30:27 most of our student teacher, our interns get placed
30:29 with master teachers who have classroom discipline
30:34 already established, which is not necessarily the real world
30:38 when our teachers come in and they have their own classroom,
30:40 their first classroom of their own,
30:41 they have to establish that themselves.
30:44 And so that professional development is so vital.
30:47 And as Dr. Schiller mentioned, we have changing regulations.
30:52 We have updates every year from the state,
30:55 from the federal government, we as a board have updates
30:58 and it looks like we may have more updates.
31:00 And so I will fight for that professional development time.
31:03 I absolutely think we need to hold onto that
31:05 and elevate that, not just for our teachers,
31:07 but for our other staff as well, IAs, bus drivers,
31:10 as we have opportunity, as well as our administrators
31:13 who have a lot of burdens,
31:14 but they need to wanna make sure they have the time
31:17 to be clear on what our expectations are of them.
31:20 If we’re gonna hold them accountable,
31:21 then we are accountable to provide that training
31:24 and that opportunity.
31:25 So those recommendations that he brought forward,
31:30 I’m in favor of that because as I said
31:32 on the December 8th meeting,
31:33 I think a lot of this is not necessarily policy,
31:36 it’s implementation.
31:39 - If I may just add clarification, Mr. Chairman,
31:42 to what Ms. Campbell is offering.
31:44 Your board policy number 1030.01,
31:47 development of administrative regulations.
31:51 If the board delegates to the, if I may read it, sir.
31:55 - Yep.
31:56 - The board delegates to the superintendent the authority
31:58 to determine whether administrative procedures
32:01 will be needed to implement each of the policies.
32:04 Further goes on, these procedures shall be consistent
32:08 with the adopted policies and shall describe the manner
32:12 with which those policies are to be implemented.
32:16 Further, it goes on to say upon the recommendation,
32:19 the board should adopt an administrative procedure
32:22 when required to do so by law
32:23 or when an adjustment of the superintendent adoption
32:26 by the board is advisable.
32:28 So it leaves it, and if you will wish to revise that
32:32 to make it a mandatory, thinking of what you want
32:35 to go prospectively from here
32:37 with your permanent superintendent,
32:39 not just because I’m here for three months.
32:41 This is a policy matter for the board to decide.
32:44 I can tell you that is generally around the nation,
32:49 the need for that alignment between administrative procedure
32:52 and board intent from policy is something
32:54 that’s brought back to the board for concurrence,
32:59 and Paul Gibbs can then determine
33:01 what is the proper procedure for that.
33:03 And what I’m saying is that in concert
33:05 to what you were talking about, Ms. Campbell,
33:09 is that I think that’s one of the things
33:11 that I’m recommending here that you review
33:13 and make the determination.
33:14 I would so recommend that you do that,
33:16 particularly with this newly constituted board, so to speak,
33:20 that the administrative regulations are in alignment
33:22 because again, those are the marching orders
33:25 that we, your staff, have in order
33:28 to implement your policies, and I’ll stop there.
33:34 - So your recommendation, just to follow up,
33:38 is to professional development programs,
33:41 so focus inside of there, and that would help
33:45 with some of the discipline policies.
33:47 - Well, specifically that we elevate the importance of that
33:51 when we come to collective bargaining,
33:53 that we make sure that that is,
33:56 you know, I’m just gonna be quite plain,
33:58 that we don’t lose another minute
33:59 of professional development time.
34:02 - Thank you very much.
34:04 We go to Ms. Wright.
34:07 - I recognize that there is a disconnect,
34:10 there’s a miscommunication that’s happening right now
34:12 with our district, and we can see it
34:14 when we go into our schools,
34:15 and so when I go into one school,
34:17 the policies that are followed,
34:18 they are different than when I go into another school,
34:20 which to me says we have an issue at maybe conveying that,
34:24 what these policies are, what these rules are.
34:27 I think we need to set a clear standard as far as teaching,
34:31 and then follow through with that
34:34 because we can’t ignore the fact
34:35 that teachers are leaving, Ms. Jenkins,
34:37 and they’re citing discipline.
34:38 Our bus drivers are leaving,
34:39 and they’re citing discipline as a reason.
34:41 So that is very evident,
34:44 that we have to get this under control,
34:45 and I’ve heard it from so many teachers.
34:48 The plus side is I’ve also heard from our bus depots,
34:50 and they’ve said, hey, discipline is improving,
34:52 and we’re really glad that you’re having these conversations
34:55 because we are seeing a direct impact on our buses.
34:58 So I think that I understand what you’re saying,
35:01 that there is miscommunication.
35:02 I don’t wanna be part of a circus.
35:04 None of us wanna be part of a circus.
35:05 We wanna get everything under control in the classroom
35:07 so that our kids can go back to learning
35:09 in a safe environment.
35:11 But I will also tell you,
35:12 as someone who has students in the classroom,
35:14 I get reports from my kids of a teacher
35:16 or a student that stood up and puffed out their teacher.
35:19 I hear these things that are happening.
35:21 So it is happening, it does exist.
35:24 Whether or not it’s being documented
35:25 or being followed through, I don’t really know,
35:28 but there is a disconnect that’s happening,
35:29 and we need to figure out where that lies and how we fix it.
35:33 We have policies, but we also have guidelines.
35:35 And I think that’s where it’s like,
35:37 I guess we’re not calling them standard,
35:39 administrative procedures, okay.
35:41 So we have policy,
35:42 which should steer our administrative procedures.
35:45 But what are we actually,
35:47 are we looking at the administrative procedures?
35:49 Have we seen all of those?
35:50 Are we reviewing those as a board?
35:53 If we’re not, we need to be,
35:54 because I think that that becomes very confusing
35:57 on what is the rule here?
35:59 Is it an administrative procedure?
36:00 Is it a policy?
36:01 Do they violate each other?
36:02 I don’t know.
36:04 But regardless, we have to maintain a classroom
36:09 that has, it’s a productive learning environment.
36:12 And I think right now we’ve gotten further
36:14 and further away from that.
36:15 It’s coming into line.
36:16 I think the cell phone, that I’m hearing from people,
36:19 that we’re seeing a tremendous impact,
36:21 that kids aren’t bringing their cell phones out,
36:22 which, praise Jesus, that’s great.
36:24 Students are listening to these rules
36:27 that we’re putting in place.
36:28 But we need to make sure that our policies
36:29 and our administrative procedures are being reviewed
36:32 by this board, because we wanna make sure
36:35 that our teachers are safe,
36:36 and we wanna make sure that our students are safe.
36:37 And that’s the ultimate goal here.
36:41 - Thank you.
36:42 - May I just quickly respond?
36:44 The administrative procedures, we’ll call them that,
36:47 are also on your website.
36:50 At this point in time, from my judgment,
36:52 they appear to be in alignment with the existing policies.
36:57 Okay, over the time, that’s been done
36:59 by previous boards, previous administration.
37:03 So it’s just a matter now, are these policies
37:06 the ones that this board want to continue or amend?
37:12 And if they wish to be continued,
37:15 then you’re basically going to then update it for,
37:19 as it requires, stamped updated.
37:22 If indeed this board determines that its policies,
37:27 the bylaws, the policies that you need to focus on,
37:32 staff is already at work, have triaged out
37:35 who’s responsible for facilities, who’s responsible.
37:37 We’re gonna crack through that,
37:39 because cabinet members and staff are already at work,
37:43 like in facilities, like instruction.
37:47 The fine people, most of whom are back there,
37:49 are the ones who are gonna work on that
37:51 that we’ll bring to you this spring.
37:55 So if the board will focus on that,
37:57 and if the board wishes, so that’s where we are
38:00 with the alignment that’s there,
38:02 which has been there since Dr. Blackburn is still extant.
38:07 It’s going forward now, this board has the obligation,
38:11 and you have a policy here that says every five years,
38:15 all of your policies need to, and many of these,
38:17 you can see, are vintage, ‘08, ‘09.
38:24 - 2002.
38:25 - Yeah, 2002, not ‘19.
38:28 So now is the time, with this new board,
38:31 and with an interim superintendent,
38:33 we could get this working.
38:34 The new permanent superintendent coming in
38:37 will be able to know precisely,
38:39 and that’s wonderful understanding,
38:42 as you go through your interview process and search,
38:45 that she or he, candidate, may understand
38:48 that this is the policy and the administrative regulations
38:52 that she or he are going to be expected to operate on,
38:55 and the board is comfortable with that.
38:57 That’s the alignment that I’m hoping that we can get to,
38:59 because this fine group of people,
39:02 as they continue the work after June 1,
39:06 and the new person is operational,
39:09 they have the framework for which they can go about
39:11 with their training, implementation, turnkey,
39:15 and as you indicated, Ms. Campbell,
39:17 I think the cabinet will be saying 100%.
39:21 They need the time and resources
39:22 in order to be able to turnkey this
39:24 before we start the new school year.
39:27 As much as we could do now, as soon as you quickly work.
39:29 Thank you.
39:30 - Thank you, okay.
39:32 Go ahead, Mr. Trent.
39:36 - All right, well the advantage of going last,
39:38 as much as has been said already that I agree with.
39:41 Policy, and Dr. Schiller, thank you for all your work
39:44 you’ve been doing so far.
39:46 We’re fortunate to have your experience in this matter.
39:49 I think everything has the proper timing right now.
39:53 So, policy.
39:55 Well naturally, it would be nice to do that review process
39:59 and amend, and it’s supposed to be every five years,
40:01 and with the new board, again, timing’s great.
40:02 I know we’re gonna be taking a look at that,
40:05 along with the new superintendent that’s coming in.
40:09 But what influences policy?
40:12 Well I think we see that purpose,
40:15 or not on purpose, just natural,
40:16 is personality influences policy.
40:21 Culture influences policy.
40:24 But it’s all about the implementation.
40:26 And for me, the discipline, if it’s an issue,
40:29 has all been about implementation of current policy.
40:33 And of course, again, we’ll review and amend the policy.
40:36 But I think what we’re in the middle of
40:39 is either a lack, or just how our policies
40:43 have been implemented, from the classroom,
40:47 to administration, to district.
40:49 But I think this deep dive into this discipline,
40:51 and this discipline issue,
40:53 has all been about implementation.
40:56 So I think that’s what we’re taking the cover off of now,
40:59 and saying, as a result of how we have been implementing
41:03 our policies, what are we living with now?
41:06 And I think we see what we’ve had.
41:10 And the teachers have been reaching out.
41:13 And seriously, things have been changing,
41:15 all the way from the bus.
41:18 1010 has been saying that things are looking up.
41:23 They’re excited about what the future holds.
41:26 And the biggest thing is that at least
41:28 we’re not listening.
41:31 So the whole, if you want to call it show,
41:33 or whatever people call it, those were real issues.
41:37 And those continue to be real issues.
41:39 We just have to get across to all our stakeholders
41:44 that this is gonna take time.
41:46 And I mean, we’ll be here a year from now with progress.
41:49 But yet, much work still needing to be done.
41:52 And professional development is a big issue there.
41:55 Classroom management is the biggest reason
41:58 teachers leave in the first three years of teaching.
42:00 It’s not content that matters.
42:02 It’s being able to handle the classroom.
42:05 So any attention we can spend on that.
42:08 I mean, any PD that’s actually productive,
42:11 as a teacher, we appreciate.
42:13 We’ve had plenty of that, or not.
42:15 So something that we can actually use
42:16 in a classroom would be wonderful.
42:18 Again, lots of work ahead.
42:21 But you have been working tirelessly.
42:25 And we appreciate that.
42:27 So I just look forward to what we’re going
42:29 to be doing here, moving forward.
42:31 Thanks.
42:32 - Thank you, Mr. Trent.
42:36 Truly appreciate it.
42:37 Dr. Shiller, when you spoke to the fidelity
42:40 of the policies and the procedures,
42:44 did you meet with any principals,
42:46 sit down and communicate to them on what exactly?
42:53 - No, sir, time is not permitted.
42:54 I have to rely upon the very fine communications
42:59 of our directors and our assistant superintendents
43:03 along that line.
43:04 And so I just have not had the opportunity
43:07 to get to that level, understandably.
43:09 I have been able to glean from their experiences.
43:15 We benefit in this district by having a one,
43:18 basically a one to nine ratio between directors
43:21 and principals in schools.
43:23 That is unheard of in other comparable districts here
43:27 nationwide range from a low of one to 15
43:29 to a one of 25 in Pinellas County.
43:34 Given the terrific organization
43:38 that we have of infrastructure,
43:41 the linkage between them, the assistant superintendent,
43:44 their directors and their linkage to the principals
43:48 had the mechanism in place to be able to identify
43:52 where the issues are.
43:53 And so what has come up to me
43:56 through our assistant superintendents,
43:58 three in the last two weeks, more like two,
44:01 because Dr. Sullivan has gratefully stepped in
44:05 until we were able to get someone to take over
44:07 as the assistant superintendent.
44:09 This is what being conveyed to me.
44:11 And I trust that judgment.
44:13 If I stand corrected, I would ask them to say it.
44:16 But the bottom line is I want to,
44:19 I just haven’t had that time.
44:21 - Okay.
44:22 - If, you know, and that’s why going forward,
44:24 like this go forward plan, I’d like to discuss with you
44:27 when you are ready for it, gets to some of those pieces.
44:31 If you can do the policies and to add to it,
44:34 number five, the wireless communication devices,
44:38 the student conduct, and that other one,
44:41 the policy manual removal out of school suspension.
44:43 If you put that on the top of your list,
44:46 at least we can get a running start.
44:48 ‘Cause those are your policies
44:50 under the 5,000 range of students.
44:52 So, and you also have here, as we say,
44:55 I’m trying to meld the two of the next discussion.
44:59 The policies are integrated with the procedures,
45:02 which is integrated with how we go forward
45:05 to capture this board’s values, mission, vision,
45:09 operational values.
45:11 Those are where I think if you dig in right away,
45:13 and some of these are one-pagers, we can make progress.
45:17 Now, what I’d like, sorry, when you’re ready to turn back,
45:21 is to kind of go through the other steps.
45:24 - I have a series of questions.
45:25 I just need to get answered.
45:26 So you did not meet with any principals.
45:28 You’ve met with some of the labor groups.
45:31 And what was the outcome of some of those conversations?
45:33 What did they ask you and say some of the things
45:35 that were going on that you needed to address?
45:38 - I have a whole litany, having met with a large group
45:42 hosted by the BFP and with representatives
45:46 from all of the organizations,
45:49 including the sheriff being president and others.
45:52 And sharing with me everything from the different levels
45:57 to the different real or perceived aspects
46:01 of the change of the statutes, I’m sorry,
46:04 of the Title IX and what influence that has had.
46:08 The ongoing advisories and direction
46:10 that we get most recently from I think last week
46:14 that Mrs. Bland brought to my attention.
46:17 There’s constant updates from state, federal.
46:21 There’s carryover from previous administrations
46:23 at the national level that are still in effect
46:26 that have not been addressed.
46:28 So what I got from that meeting and follow-up to meetings
46:34 with each of the organizations representing the principals
46:37 and the teachers in 1010 are a whole list of things,
46:43 including bus drivers.
46:44 When I visited the, was at the Central Depot
46:48 and with the director, Dr. Miller.
46:51 So I’m hearing everything from with regard
46:55 to discipline issues that drivers are experiencing,
46:58 paras have reported the different interpretations
47:06 of the federal and state statutes.
47:10 And also what certain procedures for certain students
47:18 and what kinds of protections and what kind of steps
47:22 that need to be taken that may be at variance
47:25 with alternative ways of approaching it at the school level.
47:29 So trying to be on the highest level,
47:32 I think I’ve heard the whole panoply of what is,
47:36 and I break it down to a couple of things.
47:38 One, there’s an inference service and clarification
47:42 that everyone, all groups, stakeholders, principals,
47:45 teachers, parents understand that there are certain kinds
47:49 of federal and state statutes and regulations
47:53 that have certain controlling elements
47:57 of how students need to be able to be administered,
48:04 which sometimes may run contrary to what one might want to do
48:08 or think is in the best interest.
48:09 We’ve got to clarify that.
48:10 So part of it is a full, complete understanding by everyone.
48:14 And that’s part of what the rollout of having
48:17 all of these fine committees that have been proposed,
48:21 a way to, we’ve talked also about how we can now hold
48:25 regional meetings where staff and I can address
48:28 the principals and the teachers to try to address
48:32 some of these matters for clarity right now.
48:36 So I believe that I’m read in, obviously each of you,
48:41 the eyes and ears of your community can convey
48:44 to me more of this so that I can then have our staff
48:49 look at and see what it’d be.
48:51 So I would chalk up those things, sir, to one,
48:55 the need for full clarity and transparency
48:58 with all stakeholders and staff regarding requirements.
49:04 Number two, with the need for the board to say yes,
49:10 as Ms. Campbell and Ms. Jenkins led off with,
49:15 these existing policies and administrative breaks
49:19 are in effect as they are now
49:21 being administered accordingly.
49:23 Now the opportunity for the board to redefine,
49:26 if it wishes, these and all the others
49:29 so that we can now put everything in place.
49:31 Some be able to be turned around overnight,
49:34 others gonna be turned around hopefully in time
49:36 of the new permanent superintendent for a new school year.
49:40 Thirdly, the need for the training,
49:42 the need for the training, the time for the training,
49:46 and a consistent application of your board policies
49:52 and administrative regulations.
49:53 Right now, the inconsistencies are partly due
49:56 for our administrators doing in the best interest
49:59 of the kids in their school that may be at variance
50:02 at times from another school.
50:05 - Thank you, Dr. Shiller.
50:06 One of the things that I would like to reiterate
50:08 is that the head of the Bassett,
50:10 which is the administrators came forward
50:12 and said that there was an extreme amount of issues
50:15 that they are dealing with.
50:17 Also, the teacher’s union brought forward
50:19 many assessor violations that were not reported.
50:22 We had many of our cell phones.
50:25 We had everything that was inside of there
50:27 that was communicated both on March 8th
50:30 inside of your possible committees is an issue.
50:34 And I feel it’s disingenuous to our members of our staff
50:39 and others to say that what is going on is completely normal
50:43 and that people are following the procedures
50:45 and following the administrative policies
50:47 and everything else when in the fact that we have
50:49 all of our union groups for the first time in unison
50:52 saying there’s something wrong.
50:54 I have multiple principals that are saying
50:56 that they lost complete control over suspensions,
50:59 which is something that was different,
51:02 that was something that our staff gave back to them.
51:05 We have many situations where teachers were talking
51:09 about cell phones not being able to enforce them,
51:12 but then not being able to get the support that they needed.
51:15 So this board on December 8th made a directive
51:18 to initiate the cell phone to enforce the cell phone policy.
51:23 And since that cell phone policy was we set for direction,
51:27 there was schools that just didn’t really
51:30 even make communications, right?
51:32 So when we talk about the cell phone policies
51:35 and setting forward, I’m glad that we’re here today,
51:38 but I feel very, very, it is disingenuous
51:41 to tell three of our major unions that we have together
51:45 along with many principals that I’ve had conversations with
51:47 that say otherwise that the process and policies
51:50 and procedures that we’re following are right.
51:53 And I would argue that until the, I will stand by that
51:57 and I will make that as something that we need to address.
52:01 But I will tell you this much right now.
52:04 We, you opened up the discussion around what we want, right?
52:07 - Yes, sir.
52:08 - So now we’re gonna go through each one of the things
52:10 now that we kind of talked about, hey, this is what it is.
52:13 But I would say directly to you
52:15 that until you meet with the principals,
52:17 until there’s a survey that goes out to the staff,
52:20 until we truly look at all of our assessor reporting
52:24 according to our workers comp claims,
52:27 according to all of those things,
52:29 we cannot with fidelity say that the policies
52:31 that we put in and the administrative procedures
52:32 that we were fighting for were being followed.
52:34 So I would make that argument immediately.
52:36 And I will be the first person that will come back here
52:39 and say that once those things are done,
52:41 if they were done to fidelity,
52:42 that we did it right and we’ll go from there.
52:44 But I think Dr. Shiller, that if I can give you direction,
52:47 I would say that before we say
52:48 that we’re doing the right thing,
52:49 that we do a little bit deeper dive of an investigation.
52:52 Ms. Campbell, I am not finished speaking.
52:54 So the next thing is, is that I would like to talk
52:58 and bring up now the direction
53:00 that we can start going through some of these
53:02 where I talk about next step is gonna be cell phones.
53:06 So what I would like to do
53:08 is we all have had conversations since we did that,
53:11 where we’ve seen many of the situations.
53:13 So I would like to say, okay, staff needs direction.
53:17 One of the things that Ms. Tammy and I had been working on
53:21 is each one of the issues that we come up with,
53:23 giving staff a form that they can record and look at
53:27 that gives them direction.
53:29 So when we come up here and we say,
53:30 hey, we wanna change this, this and this,
53:32 if we can have a form that kind of spells it out for them,
53:35 it’d be better.
53:36 And she’s sent a draft for us to take a look at.
53:39 But I wanted to start with Ms. Jenkins
53:41 on the cell phone policies and come across.
53:44 Ms. Jenkins, would you like to make any additions
53:48 or speak to the cell phone policy?
53:51 - No, I’m gonna go ahead and let Ms. Campbell say
53:53 what she needed to say.
53:54 - This was on the, we’re leaving the topic of discussion.
53:58 And I just, I wanted to make the point
54:02 that I didn’t hear Dr. Schiller say
54:04 that everything was normal,
54:05 that these kind of behaviors are okay.
54:06 That he was, I didn’t hear what he said.
54:08 And it’s all perception, people hear things
54:11 based on their perception and their point of view.
54:13 But I did not hear him say to us, to our staff,
54:17 to our teachers, to our union members, to our families,
54:20 that the behavior is okay, that there’s nothing going on,
54:22 so okay.
54:23 What he said was, our policies are in line
54:25 with federal and state law right now,
54:28 and the administrative procedures
54:29 attached to those policies are aligned to the policies.
54:34 The fact that he asked for
54:39 the professional development to happen,
54:41 that training to happen, shows that he thinks
54:45 we’re not necessarily doing it with fidelity
54:47 all the way down, that people haven’t had the time.
54:49 He said, we haven’t had the time,
54:50 we haven’t had the resources to make sure
54:52 that everybody has the tools they need
54:55 to implement it with fidelity.
54:57 So I’m just, I’m gonna clarify that.
54:58 And also, because you just threw this out there
55:01 as far as something you’re establishing with Tammy,
55:03 I’m gonna remind you, Mr. Chairman,
55:05 that we need to operate in cohesiveness as a board,
55:08 or at least in awareness.
55:10 I’m very concerned that you might be going around
55:13 having these conversations and establishing new protocols
55:16 that we have not talked about as a board.
55:17 So as we move forward this morning and today,
55:20 I’m gonna make note of those concerns
55:22 ‘cause they are building for me, so.
55:26 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
55:27 I just wanted to say that the piece of paper
55:29 that we were talking about doing
55:30 is a recommendation by our staff,
55:32 and that it was coming forward for discussion today.
55:35 So there is nothing that is being done
55:36 outside of the protocol of the school board.
55:38 The second thing that I would like to bring up
55:40 is the simple fact that there is no question
55:44 that our teachers need to have professional development.
55:47 What I’m saying is, is that when issues are happening,
55:50 when students are hitting teachers,
55:52 when students are hitting other students,
55:55 that there is a protocol and procedures
55:58 that was different than it was three, four years ago.
56:01 That procedure that is in between
56:03 is where we need to get to work,
56:05 and I don’t feel that the processes were done to fidelity.
56:09 And that’s what we need to get to.
56:10 So when I speak to, when what’s happening,
56:13 we have multiple situations where students
56:17 were violent against other students
56:19 and violent against staff.
56:21 - I believe that.
56:21 - All I wanna do is make sure
56:23 that those were done to fidelity,
56:25 and before we come forward to saying that they were,
56:28 I would like to look at that.
56:29 That’s it, that’s all we said.
56:30 - I believe that, and I actually think
56:32 the recommendation down here for us to do the RSM audit,
56:34 which we had actually mentioned, if you recall,
56:37 last time, it’s been probably three years ago,
56:41 the board suggested when we had our joint meeting
56:44 with the audit committee,
56:45 what would it look like to do a discipline audit?
56:50 You remember that?
56:50 - Yep, I was the one that brought it forward.
56:52 - And that, so here we are.
56:54 This would be a good opportunity.
56:55 So we’re not going by just stories and impressions.
56:59 We’re going, you know, RSM does a great job.
57:01 They are our internal auditor.
57:02 They are one of the entities that answer directly
57:03 to us as a board, and that is a great,
57:06 so we are getting the details
57:08 and finding where the breakdown is,
57:10 because other than that, it’s five people up here
57:13 taking a guess of where we think the breakdown is.
57:15 And I mentioned on December 8th, I still believe it.
57:17 There is a multi-layered problem, and we need to,
57:22 you know, before we start just piecemealing
57:24 what we think as a board we need to do,
57:26 I think we need to allow RSM to do the audit.
57:28 We need to allow whatever, we need to decide
57:29 what we want to look, what we want the committees
57:32 to look like that are gonna come back to us.
57:33 So we’re not making these decisions in the blind
57:36 based on what certain conversations
57:38 with either the sheriff or the unions, whatever.
57:40 I’m not comfortable making those kind of decisions,
57:42 only hearing part of the story.
57:45 And so I hate to do this, but I would really like
57:49 to slow us down a little bit to make sure
57:51 we have all the information before we move forward.
57:54 Let’s do this, let’s do this, let’s do that.
57:56 Let’s take a breath and give the process a chance to work.
58:02 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
58:03 I just wanna make sure that everybody understands
58:05 that I was the one that brought forward the discipline
58:07 to be audited back three years ago.
58:09 I was the one that brought forward in August of this year
58:12 that we had a problem on our buses
58:13 that asked district staff to do it.
58:15 I was also the one that called and had RSM come in
58:18 to begin the possibilities of having this audit
58:21 at the beginning last month.
58:22 So 100% you wanna have the data,
58:25 and that’s exactly what I’m saying.
58:26 But until we look at all of those data,
58:28 when we have all three of our union groups,
58:30 along with others saying that there’s Houston,
58:32 there’s a problem, I think it’s disingenuous
58:35 to come out and say, well, everything’s been done
58:36 to fidelity, it might be a little bit
58:38 of your professional development,
58:42 and let’s go ahead and get changed, that’s all.
58:43 So let’s get down to the bottom of it, let’s figure it out.
58:46 We’re both saying the same thing.
58:47 The issue is, is that I’m trying to say
58:49 that if the unions are all saying something
58:51 and the associations are saying one thing,
58:52 let’s not just tell them that it’s not being done,
58:55 let’s look at it past and look forward
58:57 for future procedures.
58:59 Now, what I would like to do, if you’re okay,
59:01 is to move forward on the cell phones
59:04 and give Ms. Jenkins an opportunity
59:07 to speak to any of the cell phone issues
59:09 that they may want to give direction to staff,
59:12 just so everybody understands the proper processes
59:14 for us to give recommendations to the staff.
59:16 Then at the next board meeting,
59:17 they’ll bring back the staff recommendations to us.
59:22 So, Ms. Jenkins.
59:23 - I have an objection that you’re asking us for.
59:25 You didn’t tell us.
59:27 There was nowhere in any of the preparation
59:29 for this meeting that we should come prepared
59:32 to talk about the cell phone policy.
59:34 I have a problem with that.
59:35 As a board member, as a one of five on this board,
59:39 no one said anywhere, let me slow myself down,
59:43 we were not informed in any way
59:45 that we were gonna have a conversation today
59:46 about cell phone policy, so I’m not prepared,
59:48 and I would request, Mr. Chair,
59:49 that we save that conversation for later
59:52 when I can be prepared, Ms. Jenkins can be prepared,
59:54 and Mr. Trent can be prepared,
59:56 and Ms. Wright can be prepared.
59:59 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
1:00:00 Did you receive the email on Friday, January 2nd
1:00:03 that said update on implementation of board policy,
1:00:05 zero tolerance, cell phones, and discipline committee?
1:00:08 Did you receive where it says
1:00:09 any board member discussion on discipline items?
1:00:11 Did you receive anything observed since staff direction
1:00:14 to be addressed, positive or negative?
1:00:15 Did you receive this direction?
1:00:18 - I did, on January 20th, yes.
1:00:20 That did not tell me.
1:00:22 I can borrow yours for just a second
1:00:23 ‘cause I don’t have mine in front of me.
1:00:25 Update.
1:00:27 I will tell you, yeah, it was sent, thank you,
1:00:30 after I requested the information to come out,
1:00:32 but that doesn’t tell me what’s going to happen.
1:00:37 I assumed, and maybe I assumed incorrectly,
1:00:39 and I’ll put that on me,
1:00:40 that that update meant that staff was going to let us know
1:00:44 what has been done in the intervening time.
1:00:48 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
1:00:50 Also, the board gave direction on December 8th
1:00:53 to enforce the zero tolerance and the cell phone policy,
1:00:56 which I think, if we look at both policies,
1:01:00 we’re gonna find that they’re pretty close
1:01:02 to being where we feel they should be.
1:01:04 The only issue that we’ve had is that we feel,
1:01:07 along with many of the other associations and groups,
1:01:10 that they have not been,
1:01:11 and we just need a plan moving forward.
1:01:13 So today, I wanted to make sure
1:01:15 that if anybody wanted to give the opportunity
1:01:17 to speak to the cell phone policy and some of those things,
1:01:21 which is under provide anything observed
1:01:24 since staff direction to be addressed, positive, negative,
1:01:27 these are all items that were sent out earlier
1:01:29 that I feel like we have the ability to speak to.
1:01:33 So with that, does anybody wish to speak
1:01:35 to the cell phone policy to make any recommendations on it?
1:01:38 - Yeah, I need to.
1:01:39 I need to.
1:01:43 Number one, there are assumptions
1:01:46 that because you disagree with the rhetoric
1:01:50 and conversation for the past few months,
1:01:52 that you think that behaviors don’t exist in the classroom.
1:01:56 May I remind everyone, I worked for BPS
1:01:58 for six years before being on the board.
1:02:00 My husband has been a teacher for 13 years.
1:02:03 I am in and out of my schools regularly.
1:02:05 I am well aware we have behaviors in the classroom.
1:02:07 We service 70,000 children.
1:02:10 Children have behaviors.
1:02:11 No one’s saying they don’t exist.
1:02:13 No one is diminishing that.
1:02:15 No one is diminishing the concerns of our teachers.
1:02:17 My own husband has the same exact concerns.
1:02:20 They are real.
1:02:22 I hear you.
1:02:23 They reach out to me too.
1:02:25 We are the 10th largest county in the state.
1:02:28 We are the 10th largest number of referrals in the state.
1:02:31 We are proportionate.
1:02:33 My argument is that we are not unique.
1:02:35 We are not an anomaly like has been
1:02:37 presented to the community and to the world at large.
1:02:43 My issue is that today we’re saying,
1:02:46 oh, this is what we’ve been talking
1:02:47 about the whole entire time.
1:02:49 This uncovered that we’re not implementing.
1:02:52 No, the entire time we’ve been talking about this rhetoric
1:02:55 that our policies are bad, that we got to redo our policies
1:02:58 or redress brand new policies.
1:02:59 We weren’t talking about implementation.
1:03:02 The entire time we were talking about increasing discipline
1:03:05 in our classrooms, not talking about the fact
1:03:07 that we actually already overdisciplined our students.
1:03:10 And maybe we can come at it from a different approach
1:03:13 like teacher training and classroom management,
1:03:14 like we’re having that conversation today.
1:03:17 We need to be focusing on implementing practices
1:03:20 to benefit our teachers and our students, not the circus
1:03:22 that we’ve been a part of.
1:03:23 And Mr. Susan used a really, really, really important word
1:03:26 today.
1:03:27 Disingenuous.
1:03:28 This entire conversation is disingenuous.
1:03:31 We have administrators, too, Mr. Susan, that speak with us.
1:03:34 And quite frankly, the ones I speak with
1:03:37 believe the whole rhetoric we’ve been having for the past two
1:03:39 months was disingenuous because it gave this perception
1:03:43 that they weren’t doing their jobs.
1:03:46 That’s disingenuous.
1:03:48 To say that we need– this conversation has led us
1:03:51 to the point where we need to do this audit so we can reveal
1:03:54 if something’s working.
1:03:55 And when you find out it’s working, you’ll say, yeah,
1:03:57 you know what?
1:03:58 Great, it’s working.
1:03:59 Cool.
1:04:00 But I’m going to hold you to the fact that this entire time,
1:04:03 you’ve done the opposite.
1:04:04 Without having an audit in place,
1:04:06 you’ve gone around the community for two months
1:04:08 saying things aren’t working, that we aren’t reporting things
1:04:11 to the state.
1:04:12 And that is just as dangerous as saying it’s working
1:04:14 without knowing if it is.
1:04:16 So you need to commit to that promise as well.
1:04:19 Because it’s dangerous.
1:04:21 It impacts our school system.
1:04:24 And quite frankly, let’s be open and honest.
1:04:27 Your video in front of the jail prompted
1:04:29 the Office of Safe Schools to come to Brevard County.
1:04:32 And I haven’t heard a report from anyone saying that we
1:04:35 have done anything wrong yet.
1:04:36 I feel like if they saw something,
1:04:38 they would have said it by now.
1:04:39 But unfortunately, the people who were involved
1:04:41 no longer work for our district, so I can’t ask them.
1:04:44 And Mr. Shiller, I don’t know if you were briefed on that
1:04:47 and if you have anything to add to that conversation
1:04:49 if the Office of Safe Schools did come to you
1:04:51 and talk about that visit.
1:04:52 And if they had any serious, genuine concerns
1:04:55 from that initial visit.
1:04:56 Thank you.
1:04:57 Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
1:04:59 We are on cell phones, so that was a great conversation
1:05:01 about cell phones.
1:05:02 Ms. Campbell, would you like to speak?
1:05:03 Mr. Susan, the public deserves to hear the response
1:05:10 from the Office of Safe Schools.
1:05:12 Mr. Susan, the public deserves to hear the results
1:05:17 and the visit from the Office of Safe Schools.
1:05:20 Thank you.
1:05:21 We will have time to do that.
1:05:22 Ms. Campbell, you have the opportunity
1:05:23 to speak on the cell phone.
1:05:26 I would like staff to bring recommendations to this.
1:05:30 OK.
1:05:31 And it usually comes in the form of a work session.
1:05:34 So at that time, I’ll have comments on–
1:05:38 and obviously, we need some updating.
1:05:39 It has been updated since 2017.
1:05:41 I think even just some of the terminology
1:05:43 needs to be updated.
1:05:45 Just very briefly looking through what Ms. Jenkins just
1:05:48 shared with us of the letter, I’m
1:05:51 not sure if we have it here, but somewhere we have in our policy
1:05:55 maybe in the student code of conduct.
1:06:01 And I don’t know if I’m–
1:06:02 where we have something about students videotaping incidents.
1:06:09 We have that somewhere.
1:06:11 Cyberbullying, I think that we included in that.
1:06:15 I have a vague–
1:06:16 I’m getting a slight head nod back there.
1:06:18 But it’s in there somewhere.
1:06:20 But if we want to go ahead and put it here,
1:06:22 I don’t have a problem with that.
1:06:24 But as far as looking for specific–
1:06:27 I don’t have specific line items because I’m a fast reader,
1:06:30 but I’m not that fast.
1:06:32 Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
1:06:33 Mr. Trent.
1:06:36 All right, so that’s probably the last toolbar member
1:06:42 to actually have to deal with students with cell phones.
1:06:45 I mean, we have a cell phone policy that’s in place.
1:06:49 And those continuing to read it.
1:06:51 I’m sure most students and parents who signed this
1:06:56 and teachers who OKed this haven’t read it in a while.
1:07:01 I mean, there’s a lot of good stuff here.
1:07:03 I don’t know how we can add more to a cell phone policy.
1:07:07 I’ve had students– the latest student stopped me in Publix
1:07:11 and thanked me, which I didn’t even do anything.
1:07:15 I said, you signed it, your parents signed it,
1:07:17 and your teacher, I’m sure, went over it.
1:07:19 But he was concerned about the nuisance of cell phones
1:07:24 in his classes and said, great.
1:07:26 Because what they heard was, no more cell phones.
1:07:30 And that’s not the issue.
1:07:32 I just said, no, it’s common sense.
1:07:35 When the teacher’s talking, it should be out.
1:07:37 And now what are you going to do with the teachers
1:07:39 that don’t enforce that?
1:07:42 We go back to the implementation where that’s happening
1:07:47 throughout our schools.
1:07:48 And it also happens with discipline.
1:07:50 Let’s just do cell phones.
1:07:51 That’s the easy one.
1:07:52 Where they have just lost control of their classroom
1:07:55 and just said, I’ll see you next year
1:07:57 and let the kid sit there and be on his phone
1:07:59 for the entire time.
1:08:01 But I mean, it’s a privilege.
1:08:02 Cell phones are a privilege.
1:08:04 It says it multiple times in our policy.
1:08:06 And not only can we ask students to put away your phone,
1:08:10 we can ask them to power them off.
1:08:13 We can ask them to put them away so we can visually
1:08:17 see as a teacher that it’s not being used,
1:08:19 not between your legs.
1:08:20 So you can look at texts, obviously always
1:08:23 coming from your mom.
1:08:24 But this is an issue that has to be addressed.
1:08:29 It used to be back in the old days, the earbuds.
1:08:32 I thought we lost education when we allowed those.
1:08:35 But then the cell phones came through.
1:08:37 So it’s just the implementation from day one
1:08:42 that cell phones deter that educational minutes
1:08:47 and that we’ve got to get that back.
1:08:48 But now that I’ve got the mic, we’ve
1:08:50 got to allow our classroom teachers this time for us
1:08:56 to tell them, it’s not that you need the PD.
1:08:59 It’s always nice to have the PD.
1:09:01 We still have teachers that just need refresh.
1:09:03 We’re like, oh, yeah, I used to do that five years ago.
1:09:06 I should probably do that.
1:09:07 But take control of your classrooms.
1:09:09 You know what to do.
1:09:11 We have the best teachers in the country.
1:09:13 I’m going to continue to say that.
1:09:15 But for whatever reason, some of us
1:09:18 have just given up on those little fringe things
1:09:21 in our classrooms that make it so wonderful to be there,
1:09:25 like having control of your classroom.
1:09:27 Take that back.
1:09:29 So I know most teachers don’t watch these meetings.
1:09:32 But I think I’ve asked you, Mr. Susan,
1:09:36 is how do we get it to the classroom teachers
1:09:39 and the deans that what we’ve shined our light on here
1:09:43 is just do what you know what’s right to do.
1:09:47 I’ve been told by teachers they could write 20 referrals
1:09:49 a day on just referral-worthy behavior.
1:09:54 It’s there.
1:09:55 It’s not all about hitting teachers.
1:09:57 I know that’s happening out there,
1:09:58 and physical violence is not acceptable.
1:10:01 But just the little things that keeps us
1:10:03 from teaching your sons and daughters.
1:10:07 And this cell phone policy is one of them.
1:10:10 I mean, we have to just get back to saying,
1:10:13 teachers, do what you know you need to do in deans.
1:10:18 I know it’s tough.
1:10:19 And I don’t know I’m getting it, but I know it’s tough.
1:10:21 I know in my last school, we had one dean to cover 1,000
1:10:23 students with no help.
1:10:26 So these little behaviors sometimes was even asked,
1:10:30 do you really have to write a referral on that?
1:10:32 So then it just becomes that culture
1:10:34 where I don’t care what audit you do,
1:10:37 those referrals that are not being written
1:10:39 and the calls that are not being going home,
1:10:40 those aren’t auditable.
1:10:42 So I’m going to be still boots on the ground of you
1:10:46 can have anything written.
1:10:49 We have to get it out to our teachers,
1:10:54 do what you know needs to be done.
1:10:58 Thank you, Miss Wright.
1:11:00 I’m going to echo what you’re saying to some degree, Jean.
1:11:03 I think that I’m going to use my own story from my own child,
1:11:06 one of my children.
1:11:07 When they came back to school after Christmas break,
1:11:10 I had the stern conversation that I
1:11:12 think a lot of parents did on don’t embarrass your parent,
1:11:14 don’t bring that cell phone out.
1:11:17 And on my children’s cell phone, I
1:11:18 have the ability to see when something’s downloaded
1:11:20 like an app or something.
1:11:21 So around 10, 30 in the morning or so,
1:11:23 I get a notification that an app’s been downloaded
1:11:25 on my child’s cell phone.
1:11:27 And so I thought, oh, no, no, no, no, no.
1:11:29 So I had the rough conversation with her.
1:11:31 She gets in the car, and I kind of let into her about it a bit.
1:11:33 And she tells me, oh, my teacher told me
1:11:36 and we had to download this app for something
1:11:38 that they were doing in class.
1:11:39 And so I’m like, oh.
1:11:40 So I think, again, it just boils back down to can this district
1:11:43 send out something that says, hey, guys, no cell phone
1:11:46 during instruction time?
1:11:47 If there’s something that they need to do on an app,
1:11:49 download it outside of school.
1:11:50 Because if we’re giving a mixed signal,
1:11:52 if we have a teacher that says, hey, download an app,
1:11:55 bring out your cell phone.
1:11:56 You’ve kind of opened that door.
1:11:57 If we could, as a district, just send something out
1:11:59 that says, hey, no cell phones out during instruction time.
1:12:02 You have the ability to remove that cell phone
1:12:05 if you see it out.
1:12:05 I think just the reminder will help them
1:12:07 if that’s what we’re talking about.
1:12:09 The cell phone policy as a whole, I’ve read it.
1:12:11 I’ve read it multiple times.
1:12:13 It’s good.
1:12:13 It’s solid if it’s followed.
1:12:16 But I don’t think it’s being followed.
1:12:17 I think we just need to remind everyone
1:12:19 that this is the cell phone policy.
1:12:21 Parents have that conversation with your children.
1:12:23 Do not have those cell phones out.
1:12:25 If they do, your teacher has the ability
1:12:26 to take that cell phone from you.
1:12:28 And me as mom will have to come and get it, or dad, or guardian.
1:12:32 So I think just the communication.
1:12:34 There’s a breakdown of communication here.
1:12:36 We need to be clear across the board
1:12:37 because that’s only one teacher.
1:12:39 But then other teachers have said, no, it’s
1:12:41 been good in my classroom.
1:12:42 I’m not allowing cell phones.
1:12:43 So if we weren’t able to set the precedent
1:12:45 that this is the policy that will
1:12:47 be enforced with the team moving forward,
1:12:49 I think it would clear up a lot of things.
1:12:52 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
1:12:53 Just so that I can kind of overview some of it,
1:12:55 I think everybody that had– or I’m sorry, Ms. Wright.
1:12:59 I think everybody here has great input
1:13:01 and has said some things that I think
1:13:05 is definitely good for staff to go and come back.
1:13:08 I think one of the things that needs to be reiterated is
1:13:11 that currently we have school board inside of our schools.
1:13:14 We have cell phones out in the common areas
1:13:17 as the students are coming in in between classes.
1:13:20 And this is a security issue.
1:13:22 One of the issues that you have is
1:13:24 that when you have students out there
1:13:25 and they start texting about a fight,
1:13:27 they start texting about all this other stuff,
1:13:29 that is what our law enforcement has brought forward to say,
1:13:32 hey, this is a severe issue.
1:13:34 Plus, it allows them to meet up at certain places to fight
1:13:37 or know that something’s going to happen faster
1:13:39 than we can figure that out.
1:13:41 So one of the things that I wanted
1:13:42 to see if the board would want as part of the cell phone, which
1:13:47 is inside the policy, but common areas for cell phone
1:13:52 has become an issue on security.
1:13:54 The other thing is that I wanted to say,
1:13:57 we hear from many of our teachers about the fact
1:14:01 that they don’t have control of their classrooms
1:14:03 when it comes to that.
1:14:04 And that does have something to do with classroom management.
1:14:07 And it also has to do with the enforcement.
1:14:09 So individual achievement is down
1:14:11 when a student is not engaging inside of our schools,
1:14:15 inside of a classroom when they’re on their phone.
1:14:17 Mental health, there’s a lot of studies currently
1:14:19 right now that show that there is a significant increase
1:14:23 in mental health issues the more kids spend on social media
1:14:26 and the more times they’re on their cell phones.
1:14:28 The other piece is that classroom management
1:14:30 is difficult.
1:14:31 So what I feel, the two main areas
1:14:34 that I kind of wanted to bring up to the board,
1:14:36 because I know that we have to give direction to staff,
1:14:38 would be the common areas that we would say,
1:14:43 there are no cell phones in your school.
1:14:45 So when you come on campus, you put your cell phone away
1:14:48 until your teacher says it’s OK to do as part of a program
1:14:51 or if there’s an incident that you
1:14:52 need to be able to communicate to your families.
1:14:54 And then the other one is some sort of direction by staff
1:14:58 to tell our principals, listen, we are enacting this,
1:15:01 but also give our teachers the ability.
1:15:04 Because I had many teachers that had communicated to me,
1:15:06 hey, I love the direction.
1:15:07 This is what’s needed.
1:15:09 This is what’s great.
1:15:10 But the problem is that if I tell Johnny that he
1:15:12 has to give in his cell phone, that then what happens
1:15:14 is he says, no, what do I do?
1:15:16 And there needs to be some sort of a–
1:15:18 if you don’t want that teacher to then get into a conflict,
1:15:22 reduce the class and everything else,
1:15:23 there needs to be some sort of procedure.
1:15:24 And quite frankly, that’s not something that we should do.
1:15:27 So what I think that we should do
1:15:28 is ask staff to bring back some sort of a plan
1:15:32 or communicate to the principals to come up
1:15:33 with a plan for that.
1:15:34 So I would like the reassurance that in the common areas
1:15:37 that we are zeroed out, because it seems
1:15:39 to be the number one issue.
1:15:42 I’ll go with Ms. Jenkins first.
1:15:45 Do you wish to say anything on the cell phone?
1:15:50 I just think we are spiraling in circles for no reason.
1:15:55 I speak to teachers too, and you know what they say to me?
1:15:58 Pick your battles.
1:16:01 This is something that they have to deal with.
1:16:03 If we’re going to address cell phones,
1:16:06 then you have to modify the behavior.
1:16:08 You can’t just take the cell phone away.
1:16:10 We live in a world in 2023 where adults can’t even
1:16:13 put their own cell phones down.
1:16:14 And we’re expecting a kid who comes out
1:16:16 of the uterus with an iPad in their hand
1:16:18 to put their cell phone away for eight hours a day.
1:16:20 It makes no sense.
1:16:21 If you want to implement some kind of strategy
1:16:24 that this district is going to start teaching kids from pre-K
1:16:27 all the way to 12th grade to educate them
1:16:29 on how to use devices and manage device time
1:16:34 and how to access the internet safely,
1:16:37 again, that’s a proactive approach.
1:16:38 That’s modifying a behavior.
1:16:40 That’s fixing the problem.
1:16:41 But saying you’re going to take the cell phones away
1:16:43 is no different than we already have been doing.
1:16:45 It’s not going to improve the behavior for the teachers.
1:16:50 Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
1:16:51 I would reiterate that many of our common areas
1:16:54 and every school that I’ve visited
1:16:55 over the last couple of weeks has
1:16:57 been the fact that the students are able to use those
1:17:01 in the common areas.
1:17:02 I would also like to just say, just
1:17:04 to reiterate that you feel like enforcing–
1:17:08 you’re against enforcing it in the common areas
1:17:10 because you say that they already have them
1:17:13 and it’s too difficult of a thing.
1:17:14 I’m just trying to get board direction, so–
1:17:16 The issue with cell phones for teachers,
1:17:18 if that’s the whole goal of this, is not the common area.
1:17:20 It’s the classroom.
1:17:22 So there’s no point of changing that.
1:17:24 That’s my point.
1:17:27 I’m trying to figure out.
1:17:28 We are definitely going to move forward with enforcing
1:17:30 inside the classroom.
1:17:31 I would also like direction.
1:17:32 We already have it in there.
1:17:34 But it’s not being enforced, and I
1:17:35 would like it to be enforced.
1:17:36 And I would like to know how you’re going to do that.
1:17:38 OK, that’s not up to us.
1:17:40 That’s up to staffs that if we say
1:17:41 that we’re going to do that, then they would reduce it.
1:17:44 So we give staff direction.
1:17:45 Staff comes back with recommendations.
1:17:47 That’s what it is.
1:17:48 All right, Ms. Campbell?
1:17:50 You’re bringing up something that’s quite new
1:17:52 that I have not–
1:17:54 as far as shutting it down in common areas, I say new.
1:17:59 I will tell you that having my children that
1:18:02 have been gone to three different secondary schools
1:18:06 at the middle school that they all three have attended,
1:18:10 once that first bell rings, you can have it out
1:18:12 until the first bell rings.
1:18:13 And then it’s gone until the last bell rings.
1:18:15 And they better not have it out in between.
1:18:17 And that includes classrooms and hallways.
1:18:19 But that’s a middle school.
1:18:20 My girls who have been at two different high schools,
1:18:22 that’s not the case.
1:18:23 They’ve not in class, except for in the past,
1:18:25 when teachers have asked them to use– and I will tell you,
1:18:27 Ms. Ray, I hear what you’re saying.
1:18:29 But in the past, we weren’t one to one with technology
1:18:31 and so frequently for apps like Kahoot and things like that.
1:18:35 And Mr. Trent probably used some of those as well.
1:18:38 I’m going to speak.
1:18:38 Right, right.
1:18:40 But now that we’re one to one, I think
1:18:41 it’ll be a little bit easier for teachers to say, nope,
1:18:44 not going to use your cell phones.
1:18:45 You can use the device that we provide for you,
1:18:47 because those things are available in general
1:18:51 on computers and laptops, too.
1:18:53 I’m not ready to say shutting it down in the common areas today.
1:18:59 I don’t think that I’ve gotten enough feedback.
1:19:01 I think the fact that our parents spoke
1:19:04 when they misunderstood and thought we were saying,
1:19:06 no cell phones at school, and some of them
1:19:09 went nuts because they’re like, I need to be able to know
1:19:11 if it’s an active shooter or something like that.
1:19:14 I need to know that my child can communicate with me
1:19:16 or really admit I get texts from my children
1:19:21 during the lunch break.
1:19:22 Hey, Mom, can you get me some more of this or whatever?
1:19:26 I’m not ready to shut that down, at least
1:19:29 for our high school students.
1:19:31 So I know I can’t give you that concurrence on that particular–
1:19:35 OK, thank you.
1:19:38 Grant?
1:19:40 So I agree as a teacher.
1:19:44 There are some times–
1:19:45 I mean, pick your battles, if I’m going to use that phrase.
1:19:49 Teachers are concerned about their classroom,
1:19:51 and that is the policy, but we can do a better job of that.
1:19:56 I want to make sure we have something in our policy
1:20:01 that specifically says we cannot– this is not
1:20:04 on topic on that– but is the videoing of fights.
1:20:09 If it doesn’t say specifically that that’s prohibited–
1:20:14 I know here in Polk County and this one here,
1:20:17 it specifically says that, and it’s great.
1:20:19 I think we need to put something like that in there.
1:20:22 But back to the common area, that’s going to be a tough one.
1:20:29 If we can make sure that that is not
1:20:31 happening in our elementary schools and our junior highs,
1:20:34 we can do that.
1:20:35 That’d be great.
1:20:35 Maybe they’ve earned their right a little bit
1:20:38 to be responsible at the high school level or 7 through 12
1:20:42 level.
1:20:44 But at the same time, I think if we start little by absolutely
1:20:50 100% taking control of those classrooms,
1:20:53 as a former classroom teacher, if you can guarantee me
1:20:57 that all 25 of my kids are not bringing out
1:21:00 their cell phones during class unless I ask them to do–
1:21:03 so I would be happy with that, if we could do that.
1:21:08 Ms. Wright, when you’re talking about no cell phones whatsoever,
1:21:13 I was going to just say, I couldn’t even
1:21:15 do that as a math teacher, because graphing calculators
1:21:19 are, what, about $125 now?
1:21:21 And they’ve got a wonderful app that gives you
1:21:23 a graphing calculator.
1:21:24 So many times, I would say, get your cell phones out,
1:21:27 get that application, and use that.
1:21:31 But now that we’re one on one, one on the one on a laptop.
1:21:34 But again, if it’s used for educational purposes,
1:21:37 today in college, teachers are taught
1:21:41 how to utilize technology in the classroom,
1:21:43 because they know the kids have–
1:21:46 we’ve maybe not come out of the uterus with an iPad,
1:21:49 but maybe an Android.
1:21:51 But it is useful to use that technology.
1:21:59 But it’s, again, treating those teachers as professionals
1:22:03 to know when those kids can have cell phones out
1:22:06 and when not to.
1:22:07 And letting these children, and I’ll
1:22:09 continue to say children, that that is a privilege.
1:22:12 And when we say it’s off, it’s off.
1:22:14 And if I deem that I need to take it from you,
1:22:17 we absolutely 100% have the ability to do that.
1:22:20 And there’s got to be some specific consequences
1:22:22 that if you refuse to do that, it’s gone
1:22:26 and that privilege is taken.
1:22:28 But to take it for high school age kids away from lunchtime,
1:22:34 it’s a tough one.
1:22:36 And I’m probably not prepared to say all gone today on that.
1:22:41 If we can do that as it’s a graduated responsibility
1:22:44 or a privilege, that would be great.
1:22:46 I did ask my daughter, who’s in fifth grade.
1:22:48 I’m like, are those cell phones out all the time?
1:22:50 And she actually said, no, not in my school.
1:22:53 So if we can be assured that that’s
1:22:55 the recommendation from this board
1:22:58 and from the administration here,
1:23:01 that that is not to be seen.
1:23:03 Because that’s a bad habit to start when you get there.
1:23:05 Those kids should be communicating with each other
1:23:07 and developing a relationship.
1:23:10 Yeah, and we don’t want to see that
1:23:12 at the elementary and junior high school.
1:23:17 OK, hang on, Dr. Scheller, just give me a second.
1:23:19 I’ll come back to you after Ms. Wright.
1:23:21 Real quick question, I concur with you
1:23:24 on the issue that you had brought up
1:23:29 is that maybe not the common areas, right?
1:23:31 But you had said in the event that they’re
1:23:32 being used to post to social media,
1:23:34 being used to facilitate fighting and all that stuff,
1:23:37 which was a recommendation that we had coming forward,
1:23:40 I would support that moving forward for direction to staff
1:23:43 to kind of put inside there.
1:23:45 And I think that that’s a good one.
1:23:46 But I think Ms. Wright, you had an opportunity to speak.
1:23:49 And if you can give direction on that addition,
1:23:52 that would help, too, that Mr. Trent just brought up.
1:23:55 So if I’m hearing you correctly,
1:23:56 I just want to make sure I’m following.
1:23:58 But you are recommending for staff
1:23:59 to come back to us with a suggestion on how
1:24:01 we’re going to modify this.
1:24:02 And I’m in favor of doing that 100%.
1:24:04 I’m old school.
1:24:05 So to me, I mean, if a kid picks up their cell phone
1:24:07 and they have notifications on every different app,
1:24:10 now we’re going to expect our teachers to monitor that the
1:24:12 kids actually adequately using the cell phone for a reason
1:24:14 that they’ve said.
1:24:15 If we have one-to-one technology,
1:24:17 my feelings are if I have my way,
1:24:19 not at all during instructional time.
1:24:22 I understand the common areas.
1:24:23 I understand lunch being one of those areas.
1:24:26 Do I love it?
1:24:26 No.
1:24:26 I mean, I’d prefer the kids talk to each other
1:24:28 and interact with each other.
1:24:29 But if there has to be a compromise there,
1:24:31 that would be my recommendation.
1:24:33 But I’m 100% in favor of asking staff to come back with
1:24:36 something
1:24:37 that they would revise to move forward on communicating out
1:24:40 to all of our schools, hey, this is the new policy moving
1:24:42 forward, or this is what we’re going to be changing.
1:24:46 And I did kind of just want to remind that there’s really not
1:24:49 anything that we, especially if we don’t go forward with making
1:24:55 it, you know what I mean, the common areas.
1:24:57 There is nothing that we are changing right now that they
1:24:59 cannot send out a directive right now.
1:25:02 Hey, we need to work on how we’re
1:25:05 going to implement a zero tolerance on cell phones, right?
1:25:08 I mean, like that is how to effectively enforce
1:25:11 that policy.
1:25:13 So what I’m hearing you guys say is
1:25:15 that common areas are kind of a sticky situation, right?
1:25:18 So what I would say is that I think
1:25:20 we’ve given board direction that, hey, we
1:25:23 need some sort of enforcement of the current policy
1:25:25 and giving the opportunity for staff to figure that out.
1:25:27 B, we needed some sort of professional development
1:25:31 training, which I agree with, on how
1:25:32 to deal with the classroom management of the cell phones
1:25:34 possibly and stuff like that.
1:25:36 And then we’re waiting for staff to come back
1:25:38 with any kind of recommendations that they’d want to change.
1:25:40 So there’s two sides to this.
1:25:41 One, let’s send out some messages
1:25:43 that we are going to enforce the current policy
1:25:45 and give the teachers the ability to do so.
1:25:47 And then two, have staff bring back,
1:25:49 under Dr. Schiller’s direction, policy changes and stuff
1:25:53 like that.
1:25:54 Does that make sense?
1:25:55 I think we already did that first one as a parent.
1:25:57 I know I got a letter about that right before the break
1:25:59 to talk to my children about that before we went.
1:26:02 We did get that direct.
1:26:03 And can I talk to her?
1:26:07 Sometimes I skip over the first sentence of policies.
1:26:10 But our student-parent cell phone wireless communication
1:26:14 device contract that they signed,
1:26:16 the very first one, and it says protecting student staff
1:26:21 and maintaining integrity and the learning environment
1:26:23 is the top priority.
1:26:25 One, use of cell phones except those approved
1:26:28 by a teacher or administrator is prohibited
1:26:31 and must either be powered off completely
1:26:34 or placed on vibrate in silent mode and stored out of sight.
1:26:36 That would also mean any of those common areas
1:26:40 if, number two here, when authorized and approved
1:26:42 by the site principal.
1:26:44 So they can set that policy in their own environment.
1:26:48 So if they say, no, it’s off completely, out of sight,
1:26:52 you can have it on vibrate in case mom needs to text you
1:26:54 about the dentist appointment.
1:26:56 But it looks like it is within the power of that building
1:27:02 principle to set that culture however they want that.
1:27:06 So that’s here.
1:27:07 That’s in a contract that the parent and the student
1:27:10 has already signed.
1:27:11 So how do we work with that?
1:27:12 Or do we just talk about implementing that?
1:27:15 Yeah, and to be honest with you, one of the issues we have
1:27:18 is we have this policy that we found for one reason or another
1:27:21 was not being totally enforced, right?
1:27:24 So we just need to get back to that policy.
1:27:26 And my concern was is the common areas
1:27:28 and you have other things like you have all kinds of meetings
1:27:33 that you have where the students come in for various activities
1:27:36 inside the gym and all that other stuff.
1:27:38 We would behoove us to not be a part of trying
1:27:42 to micromanage the schools.
1:27:43 They all know what’s best for their schools.
1:27:45 But the one thing that we need to do as a board is correct–
1:27:48 is to say we want this thing enforced inside the classrooms.
1:27:52 And we want our teachers and staff on both that and buses
1:27:55 to know that if they send a referral
1:27:57 or if they send something that a student was not working,
1:27:59 what is the next plan so that that is effectively enforced?
1:28:02 I think that’s what we’re trying to do today.
1:28:04 And that’s what I appreciate.
1:28:06 If we can just get a thumbs up on that, if that’s good.
1:28:09 Good.
1:28:10 I’m confused as well.
1:28:12 I want to make sure.
1:28:13 I’m not going to stick my thumb up.
1:28:14 I don’t want to stick my thumb up.
1:28:16 Because it sounds like you want to say send a message,
1:28:19 but we’ve sent it.
1:28:20 Are we sending another message?
1:28:22 Are we saying it again?
1:28:23 So the message, Ms. Campbell, effectively we
1:28:26 still have many teachers that feel
1:28:28 like it was not properly given to them for enforcement.
1:28:31 They’re sitting there in their classroom with kids
1:28:34 that are twice their size, and they’re
1:28:36 getting ready to start saying, you effectively
1:28:38 can’t have your cell phone out.
1:28:39 They effectively feel like they cannot enforce that policy
1:28:43 and that there’s going to be something that happens.
1:28:45 And as a teacher who knows about classroom discipline,
1:28:48 if you try to say something and you’re not effectively
1:28:50 able to move that out, then what ends up happening
1:28:53 is that the students will then figure a way to come back.
1:28:56 You’ve lost control of the classroom.
1:28:58 So what I would say is all we would like to do
1:29:01 is work with each one of the principals
1:29:03 so they understand that the fidelity of enforcing this
1:29:06 is what the board wants moving forward.
1:29:09 Because I’ll tell you right now, I
1:29:11 have many teachers, many bus drivers
1:29:14 that don’t feel like they are being supported in that realm.
1:29:17 And although an email went out to the staff,
1:29:19 there was no email that went out directly to the principals
1:29:22 saying, hey, you need to make sure that this is enforced
1:29:24 and that there’s proper processes.
1:29:26 That’s it.
1:29:26 That’s all it is.
1:29:27 And it’s just something that we can do.
1:29:29 So I am asking for staff to be able to send out
1:29:31 saying we’re going to effectively enforce this.
1:29:33 If you don’t have– you know what I mean?
1:29:35 If the teachers have any questions,
1:29:37 we have some sort of process in place that is effectively
1:29:39 for each one of the schools, and we can check it off.
1:29:41 And if anybody wants to change one,
1:29:43 we bring some sort of a policy change
1:29:45 back to work in the future, just like you said.
1:29:47 That’s it.
1:29:48 That’s what I was getting board direction on.
1:29:51 Hang on.
1:29:52 Ms. Campbell’s just got the floor right now.
1:29:54 Just hang on.
1:29:56 OK.
1:29:56 All right, Ms. Jenkins.
1:29:57 I’m with Ms. Campbell on this.
1:29:58 We already effectively communicated this effectively
1:30:01 in email to parents and staff.
1:30:05 I think that someone’s just looking
1:30:07 to come out of here with a talking point
1:30:09 that they did something today.
1:30:11 I think asking staff to come back
1:30:13 with how we’re going to implement it
1:30:15 is a very odd, open, broad question and request,
1:30:20 because that’s what they do in general.
1:30:22 That’s the whole point of the policy
1:30:24 and the administrative procedure in general.
1:30:26 It’s assuming that they’re not doing it already.
1:30:29 It doesn’t make any sense if you’re not–
1:30:32 I don’t get the concept behind that.
1:30:34 And just to reiterate, it’s already within our wireless
1:30:39 communication policy that students cannot video record
1:30:42 or audio record while on campus and off campus
1:30:46 if they’re at a school event.
1:30:49 The request from Mr. Ivy was more increasing the discipline
1:30:53 if someone was to do that and put it on social media.
1:30:56 If we one day go back to that request
1:30:58 and have that conversation, I’m OK
1:30:59 with having that conversation.
1:31:01 I’m not OK with what was proposed
1:31:02 and how it was proposed, because there’s
1:31:05 a lot of variables there.
1:31:06 We’ve got kids that are recording incidences that
1:31:09 actually benefit our safety of our students
1:31:12 because we get to see what happened, and it helps us.
1:31:15 But of course, if you’re using it to harass or intimidate
1:31:18 or to bully a student, that’s already something
1:31:22 that we don’t tolerate.
1:31:23 So maybe we can reiterate that part.
1:31:26 Reiterate if you do record something of a student,
1:31:29 this might happen to you.
1:31:30 This is the consequence.
1:31:31 Don’t put it on social media so we can re-educate our students.
1:31:35 It’s not our staff that needs to be re-educated.
1:31:39 And so at this point, no, I don’t
1:31:42 want to ask my staff to come back and tell me
1:31:44 how they’re going to implement the policy that they already
1:31:46 believe they’re implementing to the best of their ability
1:31:49 and with the utmost fidelity.
1:31:50 So just to be aware, Ms. Jenkins,
1:31:54 the conversation was wrapped around just saying that we’re
1:31:57 going to enforce this and telling
1:31:58 them to figure out a way to do that locally
1:32:00 at their school district.
1:32:01 I do not want to receive a report of how they’re
1:32:04 going to effectively do this.
1:32:05 That would be us getting down into the weeds.
1:32:08 What we just need to do is say that we need this thing enforced
1:32:11 and that we need to find out a way
1:32:12 to make sure that every teacher doesn’t feel
1:32:14 like they can’t enforce it.
1:32:15 That’s it.
1:32:16 Right.
1:32:16 Mr. Susan, respectfully, a policy
1:32:20 exists to be enforced, naturally.
1:32:23 We don’t need to say this policy needs to be enforced.
1:32:25 It’s in policy.
1:32:26 It should be enforced, always.
1:32:29 And we already reiterated it because we requested
1:32:32 that prior to winter break.
1:32:35 And so, again, if you’re asking our staff to come back to us,
1:32:40 you are asking them to bring us something new.
1:32:42 And so, no, I’m not comfortable with that
1:32:44 because it doesn’t make any sense.
1:32:46 I don’t believe anyone in the back of the room
1:32:48 has any idea what they would have to come back here with.
1:32:52 There is no direction for them.
1:32:53 And they’re going to be scrambling
1:32:55 to come up with some innovative ingenuity
1:32:57 to talk about cell phones in the classroom
1:32:59 that already exist in this very, very detailed policy.
1:33:04 Ms. Jenkins, I didn’t ask for staff
1:33:07 to have any kind of report back or anything like that.
1:33:10 I said that each school can figure out
1:33:12 how to make sure that each one of these is being enforced
1:33:15 and that the teachers have understand it to fidelity
1:33:17 of how that if they go to enforce it,
1:33:19 what’s about to happen.
1:33:20 I think that that is where the crux is.
1:33:23 And I would be honest with you that if we sent out
1:33:26 a survey that said, hey, do you feel
1:33:28 like you can effectively enforce your cell phone policy right
1:33:31 now, that we would find out that the majority of our teachers
1:33:34 feel like they can.
1:33:35 And they need to go to their administrators
1:33:36 and they need to handle it that way.
1:33:38 I just need to be completely honest
1:33:40 because I’m going to say again, we sent out the letter.
1:33:44 We made the news.
1:33:46 If there is someone who works for Brevard Public Schools that
1:33:49 doesn’t know that this board has said, you know what?
1:33:51 We want to crack down on cell phone use.
1:33:52 We want to enforce the policy that we already have in place.
1:33:55 I don’t know where they’ve been.
1:33:57 So just to spin our wheels to do something,
1:34:01 I would like for us as a board to get back
1:34:02 to the work of this board.
1:34:04 We’ve been asked, do we want to make policy changes?
1:34:06 We’ve said, OK, here’s some things we want to think about.
1:34:09 To be honest, we probably need to update some things because I
1:34:12 think even what you’ve been saying today
1:34:14 is not necessarily in here.
1:34:16 But can we get back to the work of the board
1:34:17 and trust Dr. Shiller and the staff to do their work?
1:34:21 And I would suggest that if there
1:34:23 is a teacher that feels like in their building
1:34:25 it’s not being enforced and they’re not being supportive,
1:34:27 then they need to work the way up the chain
1:34:29 and say it’s not being enforced with my administrator.
1:34:33 Sure.
1:34:35 So I guess we don’t have direction
1:34:37 to send an email to staff saying, hey,
1:34:39 we want to try to figure out to make sure
1:34:41 this is being enforced.
1:34:42 Is that true?
1:34:44 I would have to check the minutes.
1:34:46 No, it’s OK.
1:34:49 Sarah, what I see here, what I’ve written down,
1:34:52 is that you want, for example, the staff, through me,
1:34:57 to take a look at the policy 5136 wireless communication
1:35:05 devices dated 2017.
1:35:09 Do a scan of other districts to see
1:35:12 to what extent this is consistent with
1:35:16 or were there inconsistencies with the law or prevailing
1:35:19 practice.
1:35:20 I’ve done a quick one of that letter that was just sent here.
1:35:24 It basically is the same thing as Polk County
1:35:26 with one exception.
1:35:28 That one is newer and speaks to filming fights and whatever.
1:35:34 Take away the discipline recommendation.
1:35:36 So for you to want to see the research that we do
1:35:40 and any recommendations that we may have to bring back
1:35:43 to you about any clarifications or changes to this policy,
1:35:47 and then you as a board would determine the policy.
1:35:50 And we could do that, I hope, by February, what is it,
1:35:53 7th, the next work session.
1:35:56 It’s not going to be that long or hard.
1:35:58 That’s what I understand, number one,
1:35:59 if that’s what the direction of the board is.
1:36:01 Number two, now I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with that.
1:36:05 I need clarification.
1:36:06 That’s one.
1:36:07 If that’s what the board’s saying,
1:36:09 then I will be happy to do that.
1:36:11 Number two, we’ll bring back the recommendations
1:36:14 of any changes in administrative regs
1:36:16 that we would recommend, if that is the direction of the board,
1:36:19 as I understand it.
1:36:22 Number three, where I need a little clarification,
1:36:25 communicate with principals the fidelity
1:36:27 of what the board wants.
1:36:29 My question that’s unresolved is what
1:36:31 does the board want until it changes this policy?
1:36:35 And number two, to enforce it.
1:36:37 What is it, this current one?
1:36:39 Then I will basically, Saf and I will go and communicate
1:36:43 with the principals and the teachers
1:36:45 that what is there is the current policy
1:36:48 until such time in regulation that this board changes it.
1:36:51 And therefore, the allowance of the cell phones
1:36:57 as defined here in the policy, and as well
1:37:01 as that each principal.
1:37:03 I think it says here, in terms of what the principal,
1:37:09 when authorized and approved by the site principal or site
1:37:12 leadership team, students may use WCDs before, after school,
1:37:17 during lunch break, in between.
1:37:19 That’s where your variance is going to be, sir,
1:37:21 members of the board.
1:37:23 Because that’s what your policy says.
1:37:24 It’s not lockstep.
1:37:26 It’s that each principal may.
1:37:29 If that wants to be a policy change by the board,
1:37:33 then that is what, after you make the policy,
1:37:35 we will communicate.
1:37:36 But up to this point, this is what we operate from.
1:37:40 Is that what you would like for us to communicate?
1:37:42 To reinforce this is what’s on until such time
1:37:45 you may wish to make different changes.
1:37:47 Everything that you said, Dr. Shiller, is correct.
1:37:49 But I will say that we did not have board consensus
1:37:51 to move forward with the common areas, right?
1:37:54 So–
1:37:55 No, because it’s not a change of policy.
1:37:57 So what we– so we don’t have consensus to do that.
1:37:59 So what you have inside of your hand, everything
1:38:01 that you said is correct, except for the common areas,
1:38:04 at the end, is not something that we
1:38:06 want staff to bring back to us as a recommendation.
1:38:11 We were saying that we would like to completely–
1:38:13 Yeah, but as long as this one’s in effect–
1:38:15 That’s totally fine.
1:38:16 –it’s left to the teach–
1:38:17 the principles at each site.
1:38:19 Yes, sir.
1:38:20 When we come back with our recommendation,
1:38:23 and whatever it may be, this is the board’s policy,
1:38:26 you will make that determination.
1:38:28 Yep.
1:38:29 So if that’s the understanding, and the board
1:38:33 gives that direction, do you have clarity for the minutes,
1:38:36 Ms. Aguirre?
1:38:39 Good, then we have clarity here, depending upon the direction
1:38:42 now of the board, sir.
1:38:43 Sounds great.
1:38:44 Thank you for that.
1:38:46 So that is our cell phone policy.
1:38:48 One of the things–
1:38:49 the reasons that I brought up the zero tolerance
1:38:52 was we received an email most recently from some of our staff
1:38:57 talking about the governor yesterday,
1:38:58 and I knew this was kind of coming,
1:39:00 was that he reestablished the entire reporting guidelines
1:39:03 for assessors yesterday, which is now
1:39:05 going to completely kind of change
1:39:07 the way we report those things.
1:39:10 Dr. Sullivan was sending some internal communications
1:39:13 and stuff like that on those changes.
1:39:14 I just wanted– and I made a copy for you guys.
1:39:17 It’s inside your board documents.
1:39:21 It would be disingenuous for me to try to ask
1:39:23 you guys to even do anything.
1:39:26 I just wanted to do it as an update.
1:39:28 You’ll see under the tab that says discipline,
1:39:31 after the definitions of student behaviors,
1:39:34 it goes into identifying incident definitions that
1:39:39 are now 100% enforceable by CSER, which are like alcohol,
1:39:44 aggravated battery, arson, burglary, bullying,
1:39:47 criminal mischief, disruption on campus, major drug sales, drug
1:39:51 use, fighting, grand theft, harassment, hazing, homicide,
1:39:55 kidnapping, other major incidents, all of those
1:39:57 that are listed inside of there.
1:40:01 Just so that you guys know, Dr. Schiller
1:40:04 is going to be reestablishing how we report those and stuff
1:40:07 like that with staff.
1:40:08 Unfortunately, they basically said it’s now,
1:40:11 and the problem is that we’re now
1:40:14 having to figure out a way to do that while we’re also
1:40:16 supposed to be reporting.
1:40:18 So that’s all.
1:40:18 I just wanted you guys to know that.
1:40:20 And that kind of brings light to what
1:40:22 we were talking about before, which
1:40:23 is some of the implementation of reporting and stuff like that.
1:40:26 So are there any questions on what the governor did yesterday
1:40:28 and brought forward?
1:40:30 There’s also an entire presentation inside there
1:40:34 also.
1:40:35 So anybody have any questions?
1:40:37 Yeah, I’m going to need time to go through all of this.
1:40:40 I didn’t get any of this for staff until right now.
1:40:42 No, no, no, that’s the only reason we’re here.
1:40:43 It’s just to give you guys the heads up.
1:40:45 That staff is going to have to work
1:40:46 on that and everything else.
1:40:47 But I just wanted you to know, since it broke yesterday, what
1:40:51 the governor’s trying to do is identify
1:40:53 many of the discipline issues that may not
1:40:56 be reported and stuff like that and kind of get back.
1:40:59 Everybody OK with that update?
1:41:01 May I have a clarification, sir?
1:41:02 Yes, sir.
1:41:03 What staff has sent to us, to me at least,
1:41:07 is an update, when we have the staff here,
1:41:11 of the most recent assessor changes.
1:41:16 And I’m not sure of that.
1:41:18 And that’s dated the new SSIR rule and so forth.
1:41:24 And that’s dated, if I recall, I received it on the 7th–
1:41:29 on Monday, the 17th.
1:41:32 And so I don’t know if there’s a new one after that or the one
1:41:34 that staff’s already working on.
1:41:36 So I’m maybe one and the same.
1:41:39 It’s all the same.
1:41:40 Staff is already working on that.
1:41:42 And we have that.
1:41:43 I just wanted the board to be aware that that was going on.
1:41:45 Great.
1:41:46 But if anyone needs that, we can send that along.
1:41:49 Because I think that was–
1:41:52 and I think Dr. Sullivan was the one who shared that directly
1:41:56 through staff members.
1:41:58 And I think we’re talking about the same thing.
1:42:02 If you don’t have it, then we’ll get that to you.
1:42:05 I just wanted our staff to be able to have a copy of it
1:42:08 so that they could go through it in the fact
1:42:09 that there’s no action needed.
1:42:11 Just wanted to bring it up as a conversation.
1:42:14 All right, so that takes care of the zero-tolerance cell phone.
1:42:18 Dr. Shiller, I’m going to come back to you
1:42:21 for your discipline committee that you had brought up.
1:42:24 You wanted to speak to that, the next purpose
1:42:27 that you had, establishing a steering committee.
1:42:29 So Dr. Shiller, at your convenience, if you can.
1:42:32 Can I jump in really quick for clarification?
1:42:36 Keep going around the term zero-tolerance,
1:42:38 and it was listed, and it’s constantly talked about.
1:42:41 You just use it with cell phones.
1:42:42 That doesn’t mean the same thing with cell phones.
1:42:44 And so when you say that out into the community,
1:42:46 the public, they’re hearing zero-tolerance
1:42:48 when it comes to behaviors.
1:42:50 And so I just want to clarify, are we
1:42:54 talking about the zero-tolerance policy,
1:42:57 or are you using that as a term, as in you’re not
1:42:59 tolerating cell phone use?
1:43:01 So Ms. Jenkins, if you look on the January 20th update,
1:43:06 it says update on implementation of board policies,
1:43:08 zero-tolerance cell phones and discipline committee.
1:43:11 All I wanted to do with that zero-tolerance area
1:43:13 is that it may be affected based upon the new recessive
1:43:16 reporting guidelines, and just let the board know, hey,
1:43:19 this is what’s moving.
1:43:20 So that’s all I meant.
1:43:21 And then moving forward, the part
1:43:22 of the discipline committee, which
1:43:23 is stated on February or Friday, January 20th,
1:43:27 is to allow Dr. Shiller now to go over the discipline pieces
1:43:30 that he has.
1:43:30 Go ahead, Dr. Shiller.
1:43:33 And I appreciate it.
1:43:34 I just think the public needs to understand.
1:43:36 Please stop shutting my microphone off for me.
1:43:38 I just think that the public needs to understand.
1:43:40 Go ahead, Dr. Shiller.
1:43:44 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
1:43:45 Just as a follow-up to that last matter,
1:43:48 I would draw your attention to the most recent February 2022
1:43:53 policy manual under 5,000, zero-tolerance,
1:43:57 what it speaks to at that point.
1:44:00 And so that would be part of the review
1:44:04 that we would need to conduct here,
1:44:07 because it’s not omnibus, including the wireless devices.
1:44:15 You see what I’m saying?
1:44:16 So all of these things I would take into consideration
1:44:20 for your policy consideration.
1:44:23 OK, thank you.
1:44:25 Moving along, in trying to now move forward–
1:44:29 and this, I think, was a fruitful conversation
1:44:32 the board had–
1:44:35 there are a number of different external things
1:44:37 that have begun.
1:44:39 I’m trying to pull them all together.
1:44:41 One, you’ve established a number of committees
1:44:44 in order to bring in wide input.
1:44:47 And I think that’s incredibly important and something
1:44:50 we need to sustain and just clarify so that we are not
1:44:54 duplicating efforts from one committee
1:44:57 and other stakeholders.
1:44:59 I’m not sure I have clarity as to what their charge is.
1:45:03 Here’s what I’m trying to do, given the fact
1:45:07 that your policy allows for the superintendent
1:45:10 to create advisory committees, is that, one,
1:45:17 what our whole purpose is, I think,
1:45:19 generically– help me understand this–
1:45:20 but my purpose is this, to initiate the resolution of all
1:45:24 these outstanding issues, the policies that
1:45:28 are related to discipline, not limited to but board policies,
1:45:32 which you’ve talked about, administrative regulations
1:45:35 or procedures to bring them in alliance,
1:45:38 that you’ve spoken about, the prevailing statutes, all
1:45:43 of our in-house procedures that are taking place
1:45:46 at the school level, like our handbooks,
1:45:49 to make sure everything is in alignment with what
1:45:51 the board policy would be, and the implementation of school
1:45:55 sites, what training and in-servicing efforts
1:45:59 we need to put into effect to make sure these old things
1:46:02 happen, what our needs are in order
1:46:04 to assure the communications and the training at every level,
1:46:07 elementary and secondary, and for all staff,
1:46:11 and improve the flow of communications and information.
1:46:15 And to bring all this under that umbrella, one,
1:46:18 I want to be able to make sure that we understand clearly
1:46:21 what the roles and responsibilities of the already
1:46:24 established committees and external entities who
1:46:28 are operating within this area, so that we
1:46:31 have constructive input, but not that their people are
1:46:34 doing double duty.
1:46:36 We need clarity.
1:46:38 We need that involvement from our stakeholders and staff.
1:46:42 Thirdly, let’s work this problem.
1:46:45 Let’s solve this problem.
1:46:46 Let’s try to get as much as we can done as soon as we can.
1:46:51 But I would like to wrap this up for you
1:46:53 if we’re in time for your permanent superintendent,
1:46:56 doesn’t have to face something hanging fire and start over.
1:46:59 That’s what I’m trying to do.
1:47:02 I was aggressive here, but overly aggressive.
1:47:04 I think if we go forward with some of these other steps,
1:47:08 we can wrap this up this springtime.
1:47:11 I need a little flex time there.
1:47:12 But I would like to, if we agree what our goal is,
1:47:16 let’s do it by May, so that it’s wrapped up
1:47:19 and all the training, all of the go forward, all the policies
1:47:22 are in place.
1:47:24 And we’ve made a running start so the permanent superintendent
1:47:28 can go forward with the board in a different fashion.
1:47:33 Now, I need a steering committee.
1:47:35 Basically, what I’m trying to work through here
1:47:38 is a group of the internal people, a small group,
1:47:42 that’s going to help do the following.
1:47:45 One, go forward with our purpose to help advise.
1:47:50 Not do, but then target the kinds of things
1:47:54 are being done by external committees,
1:47:56 as well as problem solve, so that we can work
1:47:59 with the people that are within.
1:48:03 Now, there are two things that I’ve tried to pull together.
1:48:06 One is that we had a video with RSM, project manager Campbell
1:48:17 Weiss, as well as with Laura–
1:48:22 I’m sorry?
1:48:22 - Van Love.
1:48:23 - Van Love, right, I was going to–
1:48:25 and that we did that on, I believe,
1:48:27 Thursday on another audit that’s been complete, which is OK,
1:48:31 which will then be brought forward to the audit committee
1:48:34 on Thursday.
1:48:35 All good.
1:48:36 And at that point, they asked me–
1:48:39 they were seeking clarification as to what they should be doing
1:48:43 in light of what previous communications they have had
1:48:47 with this board or board chair with regard
1:48:51 to an audit of the discipline.
1:48:55 And that’s where we spent an hour talking
1:48:59 about what they would think their role would be,
1:49:03 what I would think their role would be,
1:49:05 and was very tight and closely aligned.
1:49:07 And I asked them, for clarity’s sake, please send me today,
1:49:14 or by today or yesterday, a proposal.
1:49:17 Now, that is what they did.
1:49:20 And that, I think, is attached to a memorandum
1:49:26 that I received last evening.
1:49:28 It’s in your book to read, and I’d like to go through that.
1:49:31 Similarly, late afternoon, in concert
1:49:34 with a number of conversations I had beginning in Christmas,
1:49:38 and then about 3/45 yesterday, according to my log,
1:49:41 after exchanging cell phone voicemails, Mr. Hay from OSS,
1:49:48 Department of Office of Safety and Security.
1:49:52 We have been talking multiple times since the day
1:49:55 before Christmas to yesterday, where
1:49:58 I explained that I wanted to know what is it that he needs
1:50:03 in order to satisfy, what he believed,
1:50:06 the needs for investigation of whatever he’s looking for,
1:50:10 and were prepared to provide.
1:50:11 And I also explained what it is that your internal auditors
1:50:16 are–
1:50:18 and I went through the entire proposal.
1:50:22 And his affirmation was good, because he
1:50:26 doesn’t have the kind of staffing needed for all
1:50:29 the things he’s doing statewide, that with the information
1:50:32 that their audit’s going to do, with the kind of work
1:50:35 that we’re trying to do inside with our policies
1:50:37 and regulation, that it would put them
1:50:39 in the point of being able to review
1:50:41 all of that, of the results of the audit,
1:50:43 and what we’re doing, and serve as the quality control
1:50:47 to make sure that they are satisfied with whatever it is
1:50:51 that they were going to investigate.
1:50:53 So he– and if you decide to go forward with this,
1:51:00 and RSM, and we are going to have the information,
1:51:05 and if you wish to change the scope of their work,
1:51:08 that’s your prerogative.
1:51:09 This is a running start.
1:51:11 And they’re prepared, if you make a determination when
1:51:15 you wish to go forward.
1:51:17 And Mr. Gibbs can explain the legality and the time frame.
1:51:20 We can go to the audit committee if you wish.
1:51:23 But the important thing is that we could now
1:51:26 understand that we’ve got several moving pieces that
1:51:29 have been somewhat amorphous, people looking for direction,
1:51:32 that I think we’ve been able–
1:51:33 I’ve been able to consolidate this in a reasonable fashion.
1:51:38 Get the external committees, and you’ve
1:51:40 appointed some people to it.
1:51:42 Get their input, but define what it
1:51:44 is that they’re going to focus on from their perspective.
1:51:48 Number one, get the internal folks and the principals,
1:51:52 as they are through the representation,
1:51:53 and the teachers, and local 10/10, and me,
1:51:57 and with our staff as resources.
1:52:00 Major Neal, the assistant superintendents,
1:52:04 their directors, and Mr. Gibbs, whatever
1:52:10 it is that they will be called upon for the technical side,
1:52:15 we can draw upon them.
1:52:18 So RSM, as I explained here, that OSS
1:52:23 will use the results of the audit, our internal work,
1:52:25 the steering committee’s work, and other committee’s input,
1:52:28 and board actions, that they would then–
1:52:32 would not pursue a planned investigation,
1:52:35 but then critique at the end, because they’ll
1:52:38 be hand-in-glove with us, and determine then
1:52:42 to what extent we are in a place where everyone
1:52:46 wants to be by the end of this.
1:52:48 So therefore, what– if we might just–
1:52:52 I’m still building this agenda for draft agenda items
1:52:57 of a posted meeting, according to your policy and board
1:53:00 council, to go through these reviews of kinds of things
1:53:05 that need to be done.
1:53:06 And I’m waiting for the input from these organizations
1:53:09 this week, by Wednesday, to put out the final agenda.
1:53:12 It’s a public meeting, according to your policies.
1:53:17 Anyone can sit through the meeting.
1:53:19 But it’s a working group.
1:53:22 So now, if you take a look at what RSM–
1:53:26 I’m sure you didn’t have a chance to read this.
1:53:28 If you would like for me to go through it,
1:53:30 I’d be happy, since you got this very late.
1:53:32 But essentially, what they’re saying to me
1:53:36 is that, right now, they have an internal auditor work
1:53:40 plan for the year.
1:53:45 They give you three options, if you
1:53:46 wish to go forward at the end, on the second page.
1:53:51 Option one, you could choose to forego
1:53:54 performing internal audit of student discipline
1:53:57 this time, which would result in no change
1:54:00 your annual audit plan, which I don’t think
1:54:02 is in anyone’s best interest to forego that investigation
1:54:06 or that audit.
1:54:07 Number two is that, if you would prefer
1:54:11 to swap out the internal audit of student discipline
1:54:14 and replace the property control internal audit
1:54:18 on the current audit plan, there would be no impact to the
1:54:21 budget
1:54:22 of what you’ve allocated as a swap out.
1:54:26 Or thirdly, if you wish to add to there,
1:54:29 number three is the option we discussed late yesterday
1:54:33 afternoon or early evening.
1:54:35 If you choose to perform the student discipline audit
1:54:37 in addition to their current–
1:54:40 and they haven’t really necessarily begun–
1:54:42 the property audit, it would be an additional amount,
1:54:46 as so specified here.
1:54:48 So you would have Chinese menu A, B, or C.
1:54:53 And you can get an egg roll with that, if you wish.
1:54:56 I’m sorry if I’m being light about it.
1:54:58 But the point being is that I want
1:55:00 to bring to the board your options
1:55:02 and what it is that the scope of work as proposed by RSM
1:55:07 would be to see if it meets with your agreement
1:55:10 and give me the direction and give to RSM the direction.
1:55:14 And then I can communicate back to them.
1:55:16 They were not able to be here today because of what I said,
1:55:19 that I would present this so I can tell them which way
1:55:22 and then go on to–
1:55:24 and Mr. Gibbs, would you help me with process
1:55:26 of terms of the board with regard to the audit committee,
1:55:29 what action they need to take or not need to take here,
1:55:31 or what we could do in February?
1:55:34 Yeah.
1:55:34 If the board provides direction to move forward,
1:55:36 either with option two or three, then three,
1:55:39 obviously, as a price increase, that’ll
1:55:41 have to come to the board to approve the monetary change
1:55:43 to the contract for this year anyways.
1:55:46 So that would be at February’s meeting.
1:55:49 The audit committee can be updated on Thursday
1:55:52 that the board provided direction
1:55:54 if you’re going to swap out.
1:55:55 That wouldn’t require board action moving forward.
1:55:58 It would just be a swap out net zero impact to the district.
1:56:01 We can advise the audit committee on Thursday that,
1:56:03 hey, we’re swapping out the internal property
1:56:06 control with the discipline audit.
1:56:08 And then the audit committee would be advised of that.
1:56:11 And they can– RSM would then move forward
1:56:13 with conducting the discipline audit.
1:56:16 Thanks.
1:56:17 Thank you for that, Dr. Schiller.
1:56:18 I wanted to go– before we get into the RSM conversation,
1:56:21 we had spoken a little bit about the steering committee.
1:56:24 What I may have heard you say, just so that we
1:56:26 can stay in a process, you wanted
1:56:29 to create a BPS under the policy,
1:56:32 create an advisory committee that has interim superintendent,
1:56:35 two to three members from Major Neal’s staff, VFT–
1:56:38 No, I didn’t say that, sir.
1:56:39 OK.
1:56:40 No, he is– that would have–
1:56:43 I’m trying to write this up, and it was premature in terms
1:56:46 of– and the paragraph–
1:56:47 rather, a comment wasn’t there.
1:56:49 That was an example that Major Neal would be a resource,
1:56:53 as would be assistant superintendent, assistant
1:56:55 superintendent, director, legal counsel.
1:56:57 You know, that– he would be staffing it as needed.
1:57:02 Are you– so you’re at–
1:57:04 I just– you’re saying you’re going
1:57:06 to establish a steering committee for discipline,
1:57:10 and this was kind of the framework,
1:57:12 but it might change back and forth, depending on–
1:57:14 Well, I’m thinking that it’s a small working
1:57:16 group that would be able to help clarify these different things,
1:57:20 bring the issues to it, and then we
1:57:22 can work with the larger committees
1:57:24 over this period of time to have the input that we’re getting.
1:57:29 And forgive me, I’m not quite sure what
1:57:31 each of the committees that have been formed–
1:57:33 I’m not up to speed– what their charge is.
1:57:37 So in effect, internal working group
1:57:40 that’s going to kind of help me plan this out.
1:57:44 But what will come back to the board
1:57:46 is any action recommendation, of course, for your approval.
1:57:50 There’s no power associated, because your board policy
1:57:54 has the superintendent creating, reporting back to the board,
1:57:58 and then it all rests with you, much
1:58:00 like you want to go forward in this kind of direction.
1:58:03 It’s kind of a way for me to manage a smaller
1:58:06 group that’s focused.
1:58:09 Yeah, I think if you were looking for direction
1:58:12 from the staff to create something like this,
1:58:14 along with using that as an opportunity
1:58:17 to establish a bigger one that ties into the community,
1:58:20 I’m OK with that.
1:58:21 I just think that he was looking for direction here,
1:58:23 and I wanted to do that before we got to the–
1:58:24 Thank you.
1:58:25 So if we can give him a thumbs up on that–
1:58:27 I need clarification for anyone else on this.
1:58:30 Thank you.
1:58:31 OK, that’s it.
1:58:31 So Ms. Campbell, you have a question?
1:58:33 So I think– so it sounds like we’ve had two–
1:58:38 this is a different committee from what
1:58:40 was sent out to us earlier.
1:58:41 So it sounds like this is something
1:58:43 that would be an ongoing or standing committee that
1:58:45 would be problem solving through,
1:58:47 and that sounds like the committee
1:58:48 that when we had the discipline meeting in December 8,
1:58:50 that we–
1:58:51 I think it was the BF2 suggested, hey,
1:58:54 we used to have the discipline committee.
1:58:56 We’re going to always have problems.
1:58:57 We’re going to always need to do the problem solving.
1:58:59 So that small advisory committee sounds
1:59:02 like that’s what that would be.
1:59:06 And so that’s fine.
1:59:09 I had a little question, because you referenced policy 9140,
1:59:13 about–
1:59:15 and I think I just answered it for myself.
1:59:17 But there’s a place in policy 9140
1:59:19 that says, all appointments of staff members–
1:59:21 shown made by the superintendent– staff
1:59:24 members shall never constitute more than a minority
1:59:26 of any such committee.
1:59:28 So I just want to– when I first read that,
1:59:30 I’m like, oh, we need to have citizens on that.
1:59:32 But I thought, no, because when we have SIAC, it’s different.
1:59:34 So it’s staff meeting, like district level staff.
1:59:38 Am I interpreting that correctly now, Mr. Gibbs?
1:59:43 The policy just says the staff is
1:59:46 going to make up a minority.
1:59:47 So staff, I would say, are–
1:59:49 The staff appointed by the superintendent.
1:59:50 Yeah, the super appoints all staff members.
1:59:52 So those appointed by the superintendent
1:59:54 are going to be a minority of the committee.
1:59:56 In this case, the ones that come from BFT and BASA and 1010
1:59:59 would be like– they just need to be the majority of that.
2:00:02 Yeah, they’re the outside, yeah.
2:00:03 OK.
2:00:04 OK, so I agree.
2:00:06 I think we need to re-establish that.
2:00:07 That way, you’ve got a group that can be regularly working
2:00:10 on things that come up.
2:00:12 But then we were–
2:00:15 Ms. Moore sent a plan out on January 9th,
2:00:20 giving more of a community-based–
2:00:24 involving more stakeholders, which would include
2:00:26 board representatives.
2:00:28 And of course, we have staff who are parents.
2:00:30 So anytime we have a community like that,
2:00:32 we’re including parents in there, but just
2:00:34 in that specific role.
2:00:37 And then we got an email from Ms. Bland last week,
2:00:42 the week before, asking us to send
2:00:44 the name of our representative.
2:00:45 I actually have a fabulous representative.
2:00:47 If that committee, we decide we want to do that.
2:00:49 But that was more for a specific time, five meetings,
2:00:53 not a standing committee, maybe to address the urgent issues
2:00:56 now.
2:00:57 So Dr. Schuller, are you recommending
2:00:58 that we do also go ahead and have that committee,
2:01:01 but that they work during the same time frame,
2:01:05 but on a different angle?
2:01:11 Mr. Chairman, do you want to–
2:01:12 No, no, no.
2:01:13 This is your recommendation.
2:01:14 I think he put this down.
2:01:16 Part of the conversation is that I
2:01:19 think they’re going to create a larger group with school board
2:01:22 members and all that stuff after.
2:01:25 I took it, but Dr. Schuller, this is you.
2:01:27 Concurrently.
2:01:29 I want what you have put in motion
2:01:33 so we can get the broadest type of input.
2:01:36 And if you want to create–
2:01:38 I just, frankly, there’s been some miscommunication
2:01:42 between the board, between the departing or departed assistant
2:01:50 superintendent and Ms. Bland.
2:01:53 Ms. Bland is following the directions
2:01:55 as she understood it being directed.
2:01:57 However, there was a time a week or two ago
2:02:00 when, in effect, that this is now my bailiwick,
2:02:07 and that I’m trying to do a little catch up with it.
2:02:11 And Ms. Bland, who has been an incredible resource,
2:02:14 is following what was thought to be the direction,
2:02:18 but there was a miscommunication somewhat there.
2:02:21 What I want you to do is that whatever you have in motion,
2:02:24 we want to keep.
2:02:25 Whatever you want to augment.
2:02:27 And those are the folks that we need the broader buy-in
2:02:30 from their perspectives.
2:02:32 Is there clarity as to what each of the different groups
2:02:35 have as to what their charge is?
2:02:38 I mean, it’s not in motion yet.
2:02:40 I mean, we had a representative–
2:02:42 That’s what we want to get in motion, right?
2:02:44 And Mrs. Bright said, I don’t know if everybody sent theirs
2:02:46 in.
2:02:48 And I don’t have a problem with having two–
2:02:52 but I hear what you’re saying is, what’s the purpose?
2:02:54 Because we don’t need to have this committee over here,
2:02:57 this siting, they’re going to give these suggestions
2:02:59 to the board.
2:02:59 And this committee over here is saying,
2:03:00 they’re going to give these suggestions to the board.
2:03:03 It needs to be done in concert.
2:03:04 So if we need to put a pause on that
2:03:07 until we know what we need from that group.
2:03:12 Because none of those–
2:03:14 if RSM– and it makes a conversation–
2:03:16 but if RSM is not going to come back to us–
2:03:18 they said four to six weeks.
2:03:19 That’s a pretty short turnaround.
2:03:21 If we’re not going to have that from RSM,
2:03:23 to really to be able to identify the problem areas for four
2:03:27 to six weeks, which is a short turnaround,
2:03:29 it maybe would need to just wait.
2:03:31 Yeah, and I think you’re far more articulate than I am.
2:03:37 The bottom point is that we need a baseline of what it is,
2:03:43 and not on hearsay or not on random.
2:03:46 We need a baseline.
2:03:48 My understanding is that RSM was originally
2:03:53 approached to do that investigation
2:03:56 and give us the baseline so that we’re not–
2:03:59 how many problems do we have? 600 out of 78,000 students?
2:04:03 I don’t know.
2:04:04 But we don’t want to put 98% of our effort to 2%.
2:04:12 But I think pause might be temporary until there’s
2:04:16 a redefinition of how many committees are there right now.
2:04:21 I apologize.
2:04:23 I’m not fully read in on all of that.
2:04:25 There is none at this time.
2:04:26 None?
2:04:27 We were asked to give names to submit–
2:04:29 Thank you.
2:04:29 –to a new one that has not–
2:04:30 Then that’s with your direction and advice.
2:04:35 Then we are able to then put this in effect.
2:04:38 And this is what I’m trying to do with the steering committee
2:04:41 is, all right, this is a landscape.
2:04:43 Let’s define it to our full advantage.
2:04:47 And it may very well be that the pause
2:04:49 would be the orientation and explanation of laws and statutes
2:04:55 awaiting this data and this piece.
2:04:58 And yes, it’s a tight turnaround.
2:05:01 I asked Mr. Weiss, please, this is something
2:05:04 that’s hanging fire.
2:05:05 It’s taking a lot of time and great attention.
2:05:08 And so we need to get to the bottom of it
2:05:10 by an independent auditor.
2:05:13 And therefore, our perceptions may be then moderated
2:05:18 by the reality of data and the audit.
2:05:22 And if we can possibly do that in accordance
2:05:26 with revising the board policies,
2:05:33 then it’s a very rational way to move within our desired
2:05:37 time frame.
2:05:39 Thank you for that clarification.
2:05:44 OK.
2:05:44 So basically, you’re creating the small committee
2:05:46 to then communicate and then create a larger committee.
2:05:49 And then based on the larger committee,
2:05:50 we’ll have some draft and stuff like that moving forward
2:05:53 in the future.
2:05:54 OK.
2:05:54 Their best thinking, their best advice,
2:05:56 while we’re trying to pursue all this,
2:05:58 what we can clean up inside and address, we do that.
2:06:03 It may take a little longer because we’re
2:06:05 trying to make sure we have buy-in.
2:06:07 I think that’s what the whole point is,
2:06:10 allow stakeholders to be a part of the process.
2:06:13 And then you can make an informed decision
2:06:16 and not a hurried one.
2:06:17 And it also gives all of us a data
2:06:19 base upon which to evaluate policy direction.
2:06:24 I think to me, that’s how I look upon the problem solving.
2:06:28 We can work the problem, and then we
2:06:30 can solve it if we know what the problems are.
2:06:33 Sure.
2:06:33 So just one of the things I would say
2:06:35 is, are you guys going to take minutes kind of stuff
2:06:37 to where we as a board know what was discussed inside there?
2:06:40 Good.
2:06:40 OK.
2:06:41 And Ms. Wright, go ahead.
2:06:42 That was the intention because it was a public meeting.
2:06:44 OK.
2:06:44 Tammy, you didn’t know that yet.
2:06:46 But be as it may, I think whomever
2:06:49 can be assigned to do that.
2:06:51 Because again, full transparency.
2:06:53 If people want to sit wherever we’re
2:06:54 going to be in the audience to observe,
2:06:58 there’s nothing being hidden about this.
2:07:00 It’s just that I’m trying to bring some order to it.
2:07:03 If indeed it’s my responsibility,
2:07:05 this is my suggested go-forward plan
2:07:08 to bring how to bring the pieces together.
2:07:10 OK.
2:07:11 Right.
2:07:11 And I just want to clarify to make sure
2:07:14 that we’re back on target here.
2:07:15 So as a board, we need to decide which one of these RSM options.
2:07:19 Because it sounds like the Office of Safe Schools
2:07:21 is looking for something from RSM, right,
2:07:25 to appease this audit.
2:07:27 So that’s correct.
2:07:30 The Office of Safe Schools is going
2:07:32 to take this RSM audit in lieu of them coming in to do it.
2:07:35 Precisely.
2:07:36 OK.
2:07:37 So if you look at his discipline issues and matters,
2:07:40 this was his next number three.
2:07:41 So we’re on the RSM.
2:07:43 You guys– and I’m sorry, I didn’t get this at the same time
2:07:46 as you guys got it.
2:07:48 We got it yesterday.
2:07:48 Sorry about bringing it at the last minute.
2:07:51 I did ask for an audit.
2:07:53 I did ask for them to move on it, right?
2:07:56 And so what ended up happening is this was the best case.
2:08:01 Because we wanted to move forward with a discipline audit
2:08:06 before.
2:08:06 I had requested this for RSM years ago.
2:08:09 And because of COVID, it took us back a year.
2:08:13 And Dr. Mullins came to me one day, and he says, listen,
2:08:15 we were going to do the audit on discipline,
2:08:17 but we’re in the middle of a COVID crisis.
2:08:19 Can we push it?
2:08:20 So technically, when you look at some of these options,
2:08:23 the option two, which is the internal audit instead
2:08:26 of property control, it was technically before this one
2:08:29 anyway.
2:08:30 So just so you guys know, there was a plan
2:08:33 to move to student discipline.
2:08:34 This was also recommended by the actual audit committee.
2:08:39 So it’s within line of what was already done.
2:08:41 So I think number two would be a good option because it gives us
2:08:44 the zero impact, right?
2:08:46 But I did want to just let you guys know
2:08:48 this was a process that was brought forward before.
2:08:50 So with that, Ms. Jenkins, do you
2:08:52 have direction on what you would like to do?
2:08:55 Yeah.
2:08:55 If this was a process that was brought forward before,
2:08:58 I wish we would have mentioned that two months ago when
2:09:00 we started this conversation.
2:09:02 Dr. Shiller, correct me if I’m wrong here.
2:09:04 I’m going to make an assuming statement.
2:09:07 But my gut tells me if the Office of State Schools
2:09:09 is willing to relinquish their audit to RSM,
2:09:15 it tells me they can’t be super, super concerned.
2:09:18 But correct me if I’m wrong there because you’re
2:09:20 the one who had the conversation with them.
2:09:22 Because I did ask that, and I wasn’t
2:09:24 able to ask you and get an answer
2:09:25 if they had told you that they had any major red flags when
2:09:28 they visited us previously.
2:09:30 I also appreciate you saying by doing this,
2:09:34 perceptions can be met with the reality of data.
2:09:36 And I agree with you.
2:09:37 I think we’ve created a disaster,
2:09:39 and we owe it to our community to come to the table
2:09:44 with actual hardcore data.
2:09:45 When it comes to options one, two, or three,
2:09:47 I don’t want to spend more money.
2:09:50 My gut tells me that we’re really proactive here in Brevard
2:09:54 when it comes to auditing our departments.
2:09:56 And I don’t think there was some major reason we were auditing
2:10:01 property control.
2:10:03 And so I think it’s OK for us to push it aside.
2:10:05 And like you said, if they haven’t started anything yet,
2:10:07 we’re not wasting anybody’s time and energy.
2:10:09 So I am comfortable with option number two.
2:10:12 Perfect.
2:10:14 Ms. Campbell.
2:10:15 I was trying to really quick do a search for the audit
2:10:18 universe, the latest audit universe,
2:10:20 because I was trying to figure out
2:10:21 how long it’s been since we’ve done property control.
2:10:24 But it looks like, obviously, the public–
2:10:27 don’t worry about it, Cindy.
2:10:28 She’s looking.
2:10:30 This is a priority.
2:10:32 I think we all are understanding that we need to move on this.
2:10:36 And so I prefer option two to swap them out for right now
2:10:39 as opposed to spending another $35,000.
2:10:42 Sounds good.
2:10:43 Mr. Trent?
2:10:46 Yeah, makes total sense.
2:10:48 Option two makes complete sense.
2:10:49 So I think we have consensus already with you.
2:10:53 Option two is what I’d pick as well.
2:10:54 Good.
2:10:55 And I did want to give clarification.
2:10:56 I spoke to the Office of Safe Schools
2:10:58 yesterday around 10 o’clock.
2:10:59 And he said that he was coming in two weeks.
2:11:01 And he was bogged down in Broward.
2:11:03 But Mr. Shiller had spoken to him around 4 o’clock,
2:11:05 apparently, and had gotten that communication
2:11:08 that this would be and suffice of it.
2:11:11 He probably also is thinking that in the event
2:11:14 that he’s down in Broward for a longer amount of time,
2:11:16 that this makes sense to get moving on pulling
2:11:18 most of the data for him.
2:11:19 And it kind of helps him with that investigation.
2:11:22 When I spoke to him on the phone yesterday,
2:11:24 he did have considerable concerns.
2:11:27 But he wanted to wait until he saw the data.
2:11:29 So he was definitely moving forward with coming.
2:11:32 But as long as we’re communicating ahead,
2:11:33 we look pretty good.
2:11:35 And that’s what, ultimately, the goal of the Safe Schools
2:11:37 is, is to make sure that if we haven’t followed
2:11:40 proper procedures, that they then just make recommendations
2:11:43 on how to make those other changes.
2:11:44 And if the school district doesn’t move forward
2:11:46 on some of those changes, then there’s
2:11:47 corrective actions past that.
2:11:48 But that’s usually just the process
2:11:50 so that everybody knows.
2:11:52 Response to you and to Mrs. Jenkins, yes.
2:11:56 This is coming together very quickly at the end of the day.
2:12:00 I will then get a confirming letter from OSS and RSM
2:12:04 that will get to you in terms of what I’m articulating.
2:12:10 So therefore, there’s no reason for both organizations
2:12:13 to be looking for the same data, nor making it
2:12:18 into an investigation when we don’t know
2:12:20 if it’s an investigation.
2:12:22 But because of the fact that I think
2:12:26 this board now being proactive and pulling it all together,
2:12:30 that we proceed on this plan, I had laid this plan out
2:12:34 both to RSM as well as to Mr. Hay.
2:12:38 They feel comfortable that RSM is going to speed up.
2:12:42 I even know who they’re going to assign to this project,
2:12:45 because they have great resources.
2:12:47 That they’re going to now accelerate and also provide us
2:12:51 preliminary findings earlier, until the final report.
2:12:57 It gives us the running start.
2:13:00 Mr. OSS will get a copy of what the work plan is.
2:13:04 They’re going to be working with them just
2:13:06 to make sure everybody is getting the information
2:13:09 that they all need.
2:13:11 And I will coordinate all this, because this is
2:13:15 an important thing for the board.
2:13:18 I hope that satisfies what your questions have come up.
2:13:21 That essentially, yes, that they would
2:13:24 be in a confirming capacity after it’s done,
2:13:28 but they’re going to be part of this all the way through, ma’am.
2:13:31 So I have a follow up though, because there
2:13:34 was a statement made that we spoke to OSS
2:13:37 and they have grave concerns.
2:13:39 I’m going to say this again.
2:13:41 The chairman is not privy to information.
2:13:43 All board members should know of this information.
2:13:46 If that is true, I would like in writing
2:13:48 what said grave concerns were.
2:13:50 We shouldn’t be hearing about this just like willy nilly
2:13:53 at a board meeting.
2:13:54 It doesn’t make any sense.
2:13:55 I haven’t heard anyone else tell me
2:13:57 that there was grave concerns from OSS.
2:14:00 Dr. Shiller, you also had a phone call with them.
2:14:02 Did they relay those grave concerns to you?
2:14:06 No, ma’am.
2:14:08 Thank you.
2:14:08 So Mr. Susan, I am requesting that however you can do it,
2:14:11 and if it’s not able to be in writing because of sunshine,
2:14:14 you can talk to Mr. Gibbs about how to do that effectively.
2:14:17 I would like you to let the board know
2:14:19 what these so-called grave concerns were.
2:14:22 Because again, we’re sitting here
2:14:23 having a conversation, and apparently you’re
2:14:26 privileged to information, and yet you
2:14:27 have not shared with us.
2:14:29 It wasn’t shared with Mr. Shiller either,
2:14:30 so it’s concerning to me.
2:14:32 Sure, so I think part of the conversation
2:14:35 is that there have been SESR violations that
2:14:38 have been given to them.
2:14:39 That they felt like the people who gave them to them
2:14:43 had been felt like that they were genuine.
2:14:46 They had also been given some other information by who.
2:14:49 I was not sure about, but that was confirmed.
2:14:53 And them moving forward were based on some of those.
2:14:55 And to be honest with you, he had
2:14:57 said that he was ready to move forward with following up
2:15:01 on some of those, but he’s been down in Broward,
2:15:04 so that kind of keeps him back.
2:15:06 So there is some sort of something
2:15:08 that was handed to them by somebody, which I’m not
2:15:10 privy to, but that is part of the reason
2:15:12 that he just wanted to kind of keep his eyes on it.
2:15:15 I think the plan going forward is appropriate,
2:15:17 and we’re going to get down to the bottom based on some
2:15:20 of the stuff that we’re looking at.
2:15:21 So there is some sort of concerns
2:15:23 based on some of the stuff that has been allocated,
2:15:25 but they always give some sort of research
2:15:28 to try to find that out.
2:15:29 OK, but some sort of somethings and feelings
2:15:33 are not facts, proof, and data.
2:15:35 And when you make that statement out to the public
2:15:38 that there are grave concerns, and you can’t back that up
2:15:42 with actual facts, that’s concerning to me.
2:15:46 We are causing more problems for our community.
2:15:50 So if you could maybe, I don’t know,
2:15:52 call them back and ask for something specific.
2:15:54 That’d be great.
2:15:55 Thank you.
2:15:56 Ms. Jenkins, I just want to kind of say
2:15:58 I’m not part of the investigative team.
2:16:00 So like when he calls me–
2:16:03 just because I do, I’m not part of the investigative team.
2:16:05 I don’t have the data that they have.
2:16:07 By me asking them would be a rhetorical kind
2:16:10 of general question, but I can see
2:16:11 what I can put together for you.
2:16:13 So just so you know.
2:16:14 But when we had all of our unions sitting here
2:16:18 telling about some of the stories that were going on,
2:16:20 they had grave concerns on top of that.
2:16:22 So they’re just going to investigate.
2:16:24 And they may, like they said, come back
2:16:26 that they’re not true.
2:16:27 And if that’s the case, then we move on.
2:16:29 But we have a situation that needs to be investigated.
2:16:32 And I think that that’s what they’re willing to do.
2:16:34 So Ms. Campbell, go ahead.
2:16:35 That’s my point.
2:16:35 What is the situation being investigated?
2:16:38 I think I can–
2:16:38 Discipline.
2:16:39 You can’t answer that.
2:16:39 Discipline, Ms. Jenkins.
2:16:39 I think this will help, if I can clarify.
2:16:41 So it’s an answer to your earlier question.
2:16:43 We– OSS, the Office of Safe Schools,
2:16:46 has not done an audit at this point.
2:16:49 However, I was made aware that they were here.
2:16:53 They came to Brevard very shortly
2:16:56 after that discipline meeting.
2:16:58 If we have information from them, I think it would be good.
2:17:02 If they did–
2:17:03 I mean, it doesn’t sound like they finished an investigation.
2:17:05 But if they had something– it also
2:17:07 sounds like OSS has unaudited, uninvestigated reports that
2:17:15 were given to them.
2:17:16 That’s all we have right now is uninvestigated, potentially
2:17:20 anonymous reports that were given to them.
2:17:23 And so this is going to solve that problem.
2:17:25 But if there was something that we did get from them
2:17:28 that was given to staff or whoever that was–
2:17:31 in the days they were here, because it
2:17:33 was my understanding, they came and they showed up
2:17:35 at several schools.
2:17:36 And they showed up at the central office.
2:17:40 So I mean, I’d kind of like to have what they have so far.
2:17:43 It would be nice unless that’s– I mean, if that’s against the
2:17:46 law
2:17:46 or against their practices, I guess they can’t give it to us.
2:17:48 But we can ask.
2:17:50 I think I can ask.
2:17:51 But I will say that part of investigations
2:17:52 is they just wait until the end.
2:17:54 But I will ask, just so you guys know.
2:17:56 The other thing is that you’re right, they did come.
2:18:00 And part of the problems with OSS,
2:18:01 and it’s reported many times, is that they are so understaffed
2:18:05 that to be able to effectively do what they needed to do
2:18:08 was difficult. So that’s the reason of the delay.
2:18:11 So they came in, did an initial pull, got some information.
2:18:14 And then now they’re sitting on that, waiting to come back.
2:18:17 And Dr. Schiller communicated to them
2:18:19 to create a situation that RSM can also do some information.
2:18:22 Maybe they’ll see if they align, whatever that is,
2:18:25 and come forward.
2:18:25 I was not given any information from them.
2:18:27 I was not told.
2:18:28 But they said that they had received some stuff
2:18:30 and that there were some concerns over that.
2:18:32 And moving forward, that they’d like to come back.
2:18:34 There’s not a official report yet.
2:18:37 Well, I’m not talking about you, honestly,
2:18:38 because I don’t think that the Office of Safe Schools
2:18:40 report to the chairman of the board.
2:18:41 I think they report back to district leadership.
2:18:43 So I’m not talking about you.
2:18:44 I’m not talking about asking for you.
2:18:46 If the district has received something
2:18:48 from the Office of Safe Schools, I’d like a copy.
2:18:50 Yep.
2:18:52 Thank you.
2:18:53 All right, so what I would say on the RSM audit
2:18:56 is that it seems like we would like
2:18:59 to get, if there’s any reports or data that they pull,
2:19:04 so that everybody understands, sometimes we get a report back
2:19:07 that’s like a 15-page overview and stuff like that.
2:19:10 But I would like to–
2:19:12 Dr. Shiller, in the event that they’re doing it,
2:19:14 I would like to get the same data
2:19:15 that they receive when they’re doing all of that.
2:19:18 So when they do their investigations
2:19:19 and when they are reviewing some of those things,
2:19:23 they give those back to us.
2:19:25 Does that make sense to you?
2:19:28 It makes sense to me.
2:19:29 I would just check with Mr. Gibbs
2:19:31 if indeed during the course of an audit–
2:19:34 I don’t need it until after.
2:19:35 Oh, OK.
2:19:36 I thought you meant on going.
2:19:37 I just want to make sure.
2:19:38 As long as that is the standard practice here
2:19:41 while they’re doing an audit of what can be released,
2:19:43 we’ll go with that.
2:19:46 If you wish to know what I know as it goes along, certainly.
2:19:50 If indeed it’s the standard practice
2:19:52 they only then release after they’re completed,
2:19:56 then I would just need guidance on that.
2:19:58 Sure.
2:19:58 So it’s public record, whatever they do.
2:20:01 So technically at the end, we should all be able to get it.
2:20:04 I just wanted to make sure that it’s reported to the board.
2:20:07 Yeah, at the end, their report will be a public record.
2:20:10 I don’t believe they provide updates
2:20:13 as they go monthly or anything.
2:20:15 I never asked for an update.
2:20:16 All I would request is that when they’re
2:20:18 finished to take a look at the data
2:20:19 that they receive to make their restifications.
2:20:22 The other thing I would do is to make sure
2:20:25 that those RSM meets with our unions and associations
2:20:29 to see if there’s anything that they have that they
2:20:31 may want to be a part of it.
2:20:33 And I would also make sure that they
2:20:35 interview our principals and stuff like that.
2:20:38 That’s all.
2:20:38 So I think that’s part of it, but I wanted to reiterate that.
2:20:41 I have a–
2:20:42 Just hang on.
2:20:42 Hang on.
2:20:43 Let Dr. Schiller speak.
2:20:45 Maybe just for clarification, now
2:20:49 that the board has sent a direction,
2:20:51 I would be adding this to the agenda for the steering
2:20:54 committee for their information how
2:20:56 RSM is going to move forward.
2:20:58 And obviously part of their work plan
2:21:01 is going to be doing this survey and whatever.
2:21:04 So if you indeed see something as you get more leisure time,
2:21:09 we haven’t signed anything.
2:21:11 This is just a proposal.
2:21:13 We can edit it.
2:21:14 And Mr. Weiss, that team is wonderful to work with.
2:21:17 Mr. Hay has been very good to work with for the last four
2:21:21 weeks that I’ve been working with him.
2:21:23 And we’ve been trying to communicate.
2:21:25 And yes, admittedly, because when I ran states,
2:21:29 I had the same offices, and they’re notoriously understaffed,
2:21:34 that we’re taking a bit of a burden off them
2:21:37 if we do the work, as the board has indicated,
2:21:40 going ahead proactively here.
2:21:43 And they can then be able to serve in a confirming factor.
2:21:47 And if they find something still extant,
2:21:50 then we know we’ve got to go back to it.
2:21:52 And then– yeah, Ms. Campbell, go ahead.
2:21:55 I appreciate the– I have one problem with the request.
2:22:01 And I think the steering committee absolutely
2:22:03 should help with that.
2:22:04 But I’m not concerned with RSM going to the union
2:22:06 as to hearing what their concerns are.
2:22:08 They’ve said they’re going to survey staff.
2:22:10 Those will include union members.
2:22:12 But RSM doesn’t answer to the union.
2:22:13 They answer to the board.
2:22:15 They’re doing a service for us.
2:22:16 And the ultimate purpose is to get down
2:22:18 to what is best for students in this district and for staff.
2:22:20 So I mean, whether they need to meet with union members,
2:22:24 or going to hear the stories, and they’re
2:22:25 going to see the day they need to pull, they’re auditors.
2:22:28 This is what they do.
2:22:28 This is their job.
2:22:30 So I’m not sure why the union leadership– no offense
2:22:34 to the union members, but I don’t understand
2:22:37 why they would need to be a part of that conversation
2:22:39 as a union, not as individual union members who will
2:22:43 obviously be giving their input.
2:22:45 Yeah, I think the reason is that they’re
2:22:46 the ones that kind of blew the red flag on some of the stuff
2:22:50 that was going on.
2:22:51 They were a part of this meeting.
2:22:52 So I think that they should be part of the conversation.
2:22:54 But I do want to make sure you’re OK with the principals
2:22:57 being interviewed and stuff like that.
2:22:58 Well, I mean, that’s part of their process.
2:22:59 I mean, they are going to dig into the data.
2:23:01 But it’s going to be an independent audit.
2:23:03 They need to–
2:23:05 We just want to make sure that certain entities that we
2:23:06 know are part of it.
2:23:07 And if everybody’s in agreeance with that, we’re good to go.
2:23:10 So Dr. Shiller, I think you have option two on the thing.
2:23:12 You have your discipline committee.
2:23:14 And you also have, if I can do this,
2:23:18 direction on that cell phone policy, if that makes sense.
2:23:22 I have a clarifying question, since we
2:23:25 are on the topic of OSS.
2:23:27 Mr. Susan, I would like you to clarify–
2:23:29 I don’t think we’re on the topic of OSS.
2:23:30 –whether or not you called them and asked them to come here,
2:23:34 or if they came here just on their own.
2:23:37 No, they came.
2:23:38 OSS was not called by me to come.
2:23:40 They were–
2:23:41 You have been making statements otherwise.
2:23:43 So I would like that to be clarified to the community
2:23:46 that they came on their own.
2:23:49 Yeah, I think that was stated by multiple people
2:23:51 due to the fact that we had a press conference that
2:23:53 was there.
2:23:53 So all right, thank you.
2:23:54 So we move on to the next part of this conversation was,
2:24:00 are there any other discipline items
2:24:03 that people have that they’d like to bring forward?
2:24:06 And that’s part of this Friday, January 20th.
2:24:10 Are there any other items that they wanted to bring forward?
2:24:13 Ms. Jenkins?
2:24:14 Ms. Campbell?
2:24:17 Back to my notes really quick.
2:24:20 These are topics for future conversations,
2:24:23 but I want to go ahead and bring them up
2:24:24 so we can be thinking about them.
2:24:25 Are they related to discipline?
2:24:26 They are related to discipline.
2:24:28 OK, perfect.
2:24:28 I think that this is a good time, as we are–
2:24:32 I don’t know if this is during Dr. Schiller’s time frame
2:24:36 or in the future, but we need to start thinking about some
2:24:39 other options that are going to help, I think.
2:24:42 And the steering committee obviously will
2:24:43 need to make these decisions.
2:24:45 But as a board, we need to start preparing for the fact
2:24:47 that we may need to look at some alternatives to the AOC.
2:24:51 We need to consider that, even though the public sometimes
2:24:56 has a perception that we are overstaffed in certain areas,
2:24:59 we are understaffed.
2:25:00 And we, I have heard just not very long ago
2:25:04 that we, from just hearing from people,
2:25:06 we need more people in the dean’s position.
2:25:09 We need more IAs to support the teachers and the staff.
2:25:15 The idea of campus monitors has come up,
2:25:17 which are unarmed people who help with just crowd control
2:25:22 and bringing just unruly students down to the office.
2:25:26 That’s a budget issue, and that falls on us, board, to decide.
2:25:31 And we have a unique opportunity with the millage.
2:25:35 There was certainly some of it was designated
2:25:37 to the different employee groups,
2:25:38 but there is a part that’s just kind of sitting out there
2:25:42 undetermined yet, as the needs have come up.
2:25:44 But it might be something for us to look at as a board
2:25:46 as we start to budget out that millage, those millage
2:25:50 dollars, the part that’s left, that we
2:25:53 look at providing extra support staff to our schools
2:25:59 to help with this issue.
2:26:00 Because even if we get some of these things,
2:26:03 some new problem solved, this is going to be an ongoing issue.
2:26:06 Mental health issues are not going away quickly.
2:26:08 I mean, the whole district, the whole world
2:26:09 is not going to turn around on a dime.
2:26:11 But we need to support the schools in ways that we can.
2:26:15 And certainly, IAs and campus monitors
2:26:16 are an inexpensive way to do that.
2:26:20 And so anyway, I just want us, as a board,
2:26:22 to start thinking along those lines,
2:26:24 because we do have that opportunity with the millage
2:26:26 maybe to put some funding behind additional staffing.
2:26:31 Thank you.
2:26:32 If we can stick on that ALC alternatives,
2:26:34 because I think a bunch of us, that’s
2:26:36 one of our top-blowing arguments that we
2:26:39 may want to bring up.
2:26:39 Dr. Schiller, you had a question?
2:26:41 Can I respond, please?
2:26:42 Yes, sir.
2:26:43 The question you raised, Ms. Campbell,
2:26:45 is a highly valid one and something that we need to do.
2:26:48 What I’d like to do is bring forward to you, Ms. CFO
2:26:53 Lisinski and my cabinet plan, to how
2:26:58 this budget will be developed.
2:27:02 For me, I think it’s critical for the board,
2:27:05 and I do this as a living, to look at needs, staffing,
2:27:11 over, under.
2:27:13 We can’t expect that we’re going to get everything done
2:27:16 if we don’t have the right amount of resources allocated
2:27:21 accordingly to the board’s priorities.
2:27:25 And what I would like to be able to do
2:27:27 is refine what CFO Lisinski and I are going
2:27:31 to be meeting on Friday devoted to this whole process of how
2:27:34 we can make an alignment based on what we’ve been talking
2:27:38 about individually from day one when both of you first met,
2:27:43 and then each of you have been meeting with me.
2:27:46 What are your priorities?
2:27:47 It’s critical, and we can do this now
2:27:50 as part of the budget process as long
2:27:52 as we understand the input that you have of things to look at.
2:27:56 I concur with you, but we need to have the database as to,
2:28:00 are you appropriately staffed?
2:28:03 And I’ve already started those conversations with our folks.
2:28:07 Can we do what we need to do, staff the way
2:28:11 we are with the resources?
2:28:13 And the answer keeps coming back as not really,
2:28:16 because frankly, you’ve been running on a shoestring in some
2:28:20 of these areas, and it’s been a more push-up, push-along budget
2:28:24 as opposed to taking a fresh look.
2:28:27 So if this is the direction the board will go,
2:28:30 I’d like to maybe put this on your February work
2:28:33 schedule of how we would like to propose going forward
2:28:36 with a very transparent budget, although it would not
2:28:39 be a zero base, but to make sure that everyone who would be
2:28:43 watching and now that there’s a newly constituted board that’s
2:28:48 six weeks old, so to speak, where the revenues come from,
2:28:53 how the allocations are between federal earmarked
2:28:57 categorical programs, state revenue, local revenue,
2:29:02 the millage, and how we can now identify–
2:29:06 and it may not be addressed in fiscal year ‘24.
2:29:10 It may be part of the predicate for fiscal year ‘25
2:29:14 with your permanent superintendent–
2:29:17 how we can get your district in the next several months
2:29:22 organized in such a way that you have the data to make
2:29:25 informed decisions about addressing needs and staffing
2:29:30 and resources.
2:29:31 Does that sound like a generalized plan?
2:29:33 No, I very much appreciate it.
2:29:34 Yeah, so could we, Mr. Chairman, perhaps at your direction–
2:29:38 Yeah, we’re going to talk about that.
2:29:39 –have something set for February?
2:29:40 Yeah, we’re going to talk about some of those dates
2:29:42 and stuff like that there.
2:29:43 We have, just so everybody understands,
2:29:45 we have it’s 11/20 right now.
2:29:46 We’re going to move to 12.
2:29:47 So if we can keep our conversations down
2:29:49 to about three minutes and just kind of keep moving.
2:29:52 As far as the ALCs, I think some other people
2:29:53 wanted to mention some things.
2:29:55 Ms. Campbell, did you have anything?
2:29:57 I didn’t want to skip you.
2:29:58 I’m trying to go in some sort of–
2:29:59 No, and I think that’s, rather than us,
2:30:01 we can’t solve all the problems today,
2:30:02 but it’s not like we’ve got the steering committee that’s
2:30:04 going to be developing it.
2:30:05 We clearly are going to need to look creatively.
2:30:08 Sure.
2:30:09 I’m just going to say it just plainly.
2:30:11 If we’re going to start expelling a whole lot more
2:30:13 kids, we’ve got to have the capacity of the ALCs.
2:30:16 I don’t think that’s the right answer.
2:30:17 I think we need to deal with things from both ends.
2:30:22 Obviously, kids are going to get in trouble.
2:30:25 We’re going to spell them.
2:30:26 But what are we doing on the front end?
2:30:27 But we need to have those solutions.
2:30:29 We’ve talked previously about, do we
2:30:31 change what we do with students who have drug offenses?
2:30:34 Do we get creative and look around at what other–
2:30:37 I think we’re in uniquely positioned with Dr. Shiller.
2:30:39 He’s been a lot of places to make
2:30:40 some suggestions of some creative ways
2:30:43 that we can do that.
2:30:44 Absolutely.
2:30:46 You said you may want to do something about the ALCs.
2:30:48 Yeah.
2:30:48 I mean, since it’s been brought up– and these are topics
2:30:53 that we’re going to have to have conversations with.
2:30:55 Ms. Campbell, you just brought up calling students.
2:30:58 We are going to have–
2:30:59 we’re going to have a spike.
2:31:00 I mean, if we do what we say we’re going to do,
2:31:03 we’re going to have a spike in our incidents and our referrals
2:31:07 and our suspensions and our so forth and so on.
2:31:10 So we need to talk about the ALCs.
2:31:13 And I’m sure we’re going to have much to talk about the ALCs.
2:31:16 But also talking about creative ways of maybe a K5 ALC.
2:31:21 That’s something that needs to be talked about.
2:31:23 I know it’s a shame that we think–
2:31:25 and I think five years ago, 10 years ago,
2:31:27 that would have never even been in a top 10 list.
2:31:30 But we clearly see that our issues have now not just–
2:31:36 are just in our high schools, in our middle schools.
2:31:39 But it is a K5 issue now.
2:31:42 That is, if you talk to the union,
2:31:44 that is where the majority of our concerns
2:31:47 are coming from our teachers is K5, undisciplined.
2:31:50 It isn’t the high school.
2:31:52 ISS is– we need to continue to look at that.
2:31:56 I know we have some really good programs out there right now
2:31:59 that we should be looking at.
2:32:01 But again, staffing.
2:32:02 But ISS, we’re not talking about expelling students.
2:32:05 So we need to keep them in our building as much as possible.
2:32:08 So we can give them resources.
2:32:09 And we can talk to them there, where
2:32:12 we can bring in even community members to mentor and talk to.
2:32:17 So we don’t have repeat offenders.
2:32:19 But we need to keep them in.
2:32:20 So ISS is there.
2:32:21 Campus monitor is great, Ms. Campbell.
2:32:23 We brought that up.
2:32:24 It’s worked wonderfully at my last school.
2:32:27 We didn’t have a campus monitor.
2:32:29 And we have Coach Johnson there.
2:32:32 And it made an immediate impact.
2:32:35 He was like SRO junior, not armed,
2:32:39 and had the relationship with kids.
2:32:41 But it showed that that is needed in our schools.
2:32:45 So what you had talked about, Dr. Schiller,
2:32:49 about looking at our staffing needs,
2:32:54 we should be in a better place now that the millage has
2:32:56 passed.
2:32:57 But we need to look at where we can fund these positions,
2:33:01 the IAAs, the campus monitors, the ISS monitors.
2:33:04 And I know what the public’s going to say.
2:33:07 I mean, they’re immediately going to say, look at district.
2:33:10 Look at our– are we top heavy?
2:33:12 For every one general we don’t need,
2:33:16 that’s two soldiers that we can put on the ground.
2:33:19 I know that’s what the public’s going to say.
2:33:21 So we need to be very transparent in that
2:33:22 to see if we have those funds available to properly staff
2:33:29 our discipline in our district.
2:33:31 Just for topics in the future, that’s very, very important.
2:33:36 Ms. Wright.
2:33:38 I’m in agreement with everything that you’re saying here.
2:33:42 You made a remark, and I just want clarification on it.
2:33:44 You gave us a one to nine ratio.
2:33:46 Explain that to me if you don’t mind really fast.
2:33:48 The direct supervision of our schools,
2:33:51 if one looks at the org chart, there
2:33:53 are directors who are responsible for elementary
2:33:58 and secondary that, for the most part–
2:34:02 and we can confirm here–
2:34:04 for those directors who have responsibility
2:34:06 for their principals, you have nine principals, nine schools,
2:34:11 for which directors are responsible directly.
2:34:15 And then they report to the assistant superintendents.
2:34:18 OK, and then you made a remark in regards
2:34:20 to surrounding districts–
2:34:21 Generically, yes.
2:34:22 I can tell you from all the–
2:34:24 I can tell you Houston is one to 30.
2:34:27 OK, we don’t want to go there.
2:34:29 Baltimore County is one to about 27, a little lower
2:34:33 in the secondary.
2:34:35 Pinellas is one to 25.
2:34:36 I can go through what I’m just saying.
2:34:38 I can tell you more–
2:34:39 I can tell you more nationwide Los Angeles.
2:34:42 I do want to add something to that point, though.
2:34:44 Because unless the public gets the impression
2:34:46 by the conversation we’re having right now that we are over–
2:34:49 The lower the ratio–
2:34:50 Every single one of those directors–
2:34:52 It is because of support to the schools and communications.
2:34:55 This is an ideal situation that we’re
2:34:57 working with that will then ensure
2:35:01 that between principal and central office,
2:35:03 once we get the support services, all of these things
2:35:09 are done.
2:35:10 And whomever was able to build that, they were dead right.
2:35:15 I just wanted to add that in addition to those nine
2:35:17 schools that each of them are responsible for–
2:35:19 They have multiple other–
2:35:20 They have other areas.
2:35:21 For example, just in elementary leading and learning,
2:35:24 one of the directors is over those schools
2:35:26 and our choice programming and charter schools.
2:35:28 One of them is over all of that and all of our early learning.
2:35:33 One of those directors is over their schools
2:35:35 and Brevard after schools.
2:35:38 They all have– none of them are only just doing that.
2:35:41 And if I did not say that, I was in a hurry.
2:35:44 But they have multiple responsibilities.
2:35:47 These are all things that we can show an org chart.
2:35:49 And we can definitely deep dive in having conversations up here
2:35:52 I think.
2:35:53 Yeah, so did you have anything else?
2:35:55 So I think 100%, the ALC alternatives for me,
2:35:59 I have extreme concern about them taking three days off
2:36:02 and being in there for two days.
2:36:04 I would say that for me, I want to move towards a situation
2:36:07 where they’re coming in.
2:36:08 The other piece is that you can’t tell me
2:36:11 that sending a kid to the community is–
2:36:14 some of our offenders may be doing something
2:36:17 while they’re home.
2:36:18 It puts a burden on the parents.
2:36:19 It does a lot of different stuff.
2:36:20 So I feel strongly about having that ALC alternative,
2:36:24 but now having them come back.
2:36:26 I think the other thing is, like you said,
2:36:27 we spoke about this many times, is
2:36:30 that there is a difference between a kid that
2:36:32 gets busted for drugs and a kid that is out there violently
2:36:35 doing stuff.
2:36:36 So I think that how that looks, I
2:36:38 feel like we all feel like there’s
2:36:39 an opportunity to improve the ALCs.
2:36:42 And I think you’re 100% right also, Mr. Trent,
2:36:46 on the K through 5 and stuff like that.
2:36:49 But I think you hit on something that is 100%.
2:36:52 We are talking about the kids that go to the ALCs.
2:36:55 When you talk about the amount of children that go there
2:36:58 and the disruptive patterns that they have inside of the classes,
2:37:01 you’re talking about almost less than 1%
2:37:04 of our entire population that are ALC members that
2:37:08 cause massive disruptions inside the school.
2:37:11 So I want the public to understand
2:37:12 that this board is all about creating a safe environment
2:37:16 for their people.
2:37:17 But what we would like to do, at least as far as my direction,
2:37:20 is if you have strong ISS programs,
2:37:22 the level of expulsions can come down
2:37:25 because you don’t have to expel in some of the instances
2:37:27 you can actually move them to an ISS.
2:37:29 So there’s a huge opportunity through our ISS programs
2:37:32 to provide that.
2:37:33 Because what happens is, if you can’t effectively
2:37:36 have a child who is being disciplined,
2:37:40 he will eventually get worse.
2:37:42 So if you catch them early, put corrective strategies inside
2:37:45 of, we won’t have to worry about future expulsions
2:37:48 if we’re able to give that.
2:37:49 There’s a lot of our principals that
2:37:51 are calling because they just don’t
2:37:53 have the bodies for the ISS.
2:37:54 So great point.
2:37:56 More deans, I agree with you 100%, Ms. Campbell.
2:37:59 It’s one of the reasons that Dr. Mullins and I
2:38:01 that I didn’t vote for the millage was because I said,
2:38:04 we didn’t need to have those 150 aides.
2:38:06 I would like to have more deans.
2:38:07 And that was one of the things that I wanted to discuss,
2:38:10 but we didn’t have the opportunity.
2:38:11 Steering committee, great.
2:38:13 Campus monitors, great.
2:38:15 I had a couple of other items that I wanted to bring up.
2:38:20 One of the things that I wanted to do,
2:38:22 which is very, very important, is
2:38:26 we need to review our whistleblower policies
2:38:28 and how people are being sent in, their whistleblowers,
2:38:32 and how we need that to be utilized effectively.
2:38:36 And whether it’s communications or whatever it is,
2:38:39 we just need to make sure that people
2:38:41 know that when they send that in,
2:38:42 that they’re not going to be retributed against, right?
2:38:47 The professional development program, of course.
2:38:49 And I think anything else I can bring up with staff.
2:38:52 But you guys nailed it.
2:38:53 Like it seems to me, which I’m really happy about,
2:38:56 is that we’re all on the same page for what we want.
2:38:58 It seems like across the board, we
2:39:00 are calling for the same things.
2:39:01 So I just wanted to say congratulations to all
2:39:04 of you guys.
2:39:04 Hang on, Ms. Campbell.
2:39:05 Congratulations to all you guys for everything.
2:39:08 I really appreciate it.
2:39:09 Ms. Campbell, you had something to say before I gavel it?
2:39:11 Yeah, I don’t want to rain on the celebration parade,
2:39:13 because I like to celebrate positives, too.
2:39:15 But you said something in there that I don’t want–
2:39:17 I don’t– I want to make sure we don’t have clarity on staff.
2:39:20 Or maybe it’s something you said,
2:39:21 oh, I want to talk about it later.
2:39:22 But you talked about wanting to get the students back in–
2:39:25 all of them back in full time at the ALCs.
2:39:27 And we got a memo the other day with some data.
2:39:30 One, it was approved by state, and two, the positives
2:39:33 of how it’s worked out.
2:39:34 And especially if we’re going to have a spike, like Mr. Trent,
2:39:36 I think we’re going to have to think
2:39:37 about how we handle that.
2:39:38 I don’t think we’re all in agreement on that,
2:39:40 because I would hate for you or staff to go back–
2:39:43 that was a directive of the board.
2:39:44 It was not a directive of the board.
2:39:46 And I don’t honestly think we should make that decision–
2:39:50 and maybe you’re just expressing as an idea and input–
2:39:52 as a decision if we haven’t had–
2:39:55 until we get back all this from the steering committee,
2:39:58 from RSM, from all of that.
2:40:00 I don’t think we need to move forward with that recommendation
2:40:02 when we have something that’s been working
2:40:05 and was approved by the state.
2:40:07 So I would just be honest with everybody here.
2:40:10 I really dislike the program.
2:40:11 I think that it needs to end.
2:40:12 And I think that we need to move back towards going towards it.
2:40:15 But you are 100% right, Ms. Campbell.
2:40:17 We need to take staff’s direction into all factors.
2:40:20 We can’t just make decisions based on us coming forward
2:40:22 with, hey, this is what we need to do.
2:40:24 But I will be working very hard to make sure that ALC program
2:40:28 does come back and is in full gear.
2:40:30 That’s all.
2:40:31 Can I jump on the ALC thing for a minute?
2:40:34 Because I didn’t speak on it.
2:40:35 This is something I’ve brought up as a concern almost
2:40:38 immediately, because some of our agencies and nonprofits that
2:40:41 support our ALC were really disheartened when
2:40:46 we changed the amount of time that our students were there.
2:40:49 But if we’re going to have this conversation,
2:40:51 I’m just going to prepare going, this
2:40:52 is a dirty, ugly conversation that I brought up
2:40:54 on December 8th, parts of that data.
2:40:56 It’s a real conversation that we have
2:40:58 to be ready to take the reality and not
2:41:01 say that the data isn’t on us, because we’re
2:41:02 number one in the state for ALC placements, which
2:41:05 is why we had to reduce our number to two days a week,
2:41:07 because we have too many kids getting thrown into ALC.
2:41:10 That’s why we don’t have enough staff.
2:41:13 And so this is a real conversation
2:41:15 that we need to have.
2:41:19 And I know we’re not going there yet,
2:41:21 but just even remotely insinuating
2:41:23 the possibility of a K through 5 is crazy to me.
2:41:27 We need to talk about that in detail too.
2:41:30 So this needs to be like, we need
2:41:31 to dedicate a significant amount of time to this conversation,
2:41:34 because it is a problem, and we need to talk about it.
2:41:37 So thank you for that, Ms. Jenkins.
2:41:39 I did want to say the one thing that I did miss
2:41:41 because I was moving through here
2:41:42 is that I would like the dress code policy to come back.
2:41:46 Many of you may not know, but on the dress code policy,
2:41:48 it talks about us not being able to wear crocs and leggings
2:41:52 and stuff like that that 90% of our kids already do.
2:41:55 I think it’s been an effective problem for our principals
2:41:58 to be able to enforce the discipline or the dress
2:42:01 code because of that.
2:42:03 So if everybody’s OK with them working
2:42:07 on that because it’s their recommendation
2:42:09 and bringing that back to us too, that would be good.
2:42:11 So if everybody’s OK, we might be able to get a longer break.
2:42:14 And I really appreciate everybody going through that.
2:42:17 You’re good?
2:42:17 Everybody OK?
2:42:21 I mean, we can keep going.
2:42:24 Listen, I have my power bar.
2:42:26 Can we agree to try to knock out policy review schedule before–
2:42:29 If you guys want to do that, let’s go.
2:42:31 We can keep going.
2:42:31 Let’s go.
2:42:32 I love it.
2:42:33 Let’s go.
2:42:33 All right, so many of you guys have heard up here–
2:42:37 and I’ll come to you in a second here, Dr. Shiller.
2:42:39 But many of you guys have heard up here
2:42:41 that we have a lot to do.
2:42:43 And one of the things that Dr. Shiller was mentioning
2:42:45 is, how do we appropriately get it done by May?
2:42:48 How do we appropriately put all this stuff together?
2:42:51 So what I had asked was, with that direction,
2:42:53 you guys to grab your calendars because we might
2:42:55 need to add some extra days.
2:42:57 On top of that, we have some of the items
2:42:59 that we mentioned before that we would like to talk about.
2:43:02 But those actually were policies.
2:43:04 So it’s all pretty much the same stuff
2:43:05 that we brought forward on the off site.
2:43:08 So with that, I’m going to hand it over to Dr. Shiller
2:43:10 to give us a little bit of direction.
2:43:12 Thank you.
2:43:13 I appreciate knowing some of the priorities and things
2:43:16 that the board would like to investigate.
2:43:18 That’s what we worked through one on one when I first arrived.
2:43:21 And that’s what we worked through for the most
2:43:23 part at the retreat.
2:43:24 Because these are the kinds of things that, if you shuffle
2:43:27 to me, staff can then start addressing
2:43:30 this as part of what it is that this board wants to review.
2:43:34 And one of the benefits of your wisdom
2:43:37 of going with an interim superintendent, whomever
2:43:39 you wanted sitting here for a period of time,
2:43:42 was to be able to now try to address the kinds of things
2:43:45 so that the new superintendent permanently
2:43:48 has a predicate for which the work would go on.
2:43:51 So as we hear about these different things,
2:43:54 we can then start studying, bring back to you.
2:43:57 Not that we can make the changes right away,
2:43:59 but as part of the budget process,
2:44:01 as part of the game plan for your permanent
2:44:04 and for the board, we can have these things line up.
2:44:06 So as more things come up, please, there’s a process.
2:44:11 You are now working through it.
2:44:13 Through me, so you don’t have to go to staff.
2:44:17 We then will make all of this as part
2:44:22 of our go-to plan over the next couple of months,
2:44:25 bringing back what we are finding,
2:44:27 and if that leads to a budget implication.
2:44:30 What I’m hearing now is precisely
2:44:33 what I think we need to do.
2:44:34 I’m hearing also the need not just for tactical planning year
2:44:39 to year, but more of a strategic look.
2:44:43 Given the explosion of possibility
2:44:45 of more and more students and demands on the school,
2:44:49 where should we be going programmatically?
2:44:52 Where should we be going with every other facet
2:44:56 as you redefine the future?
2:44:59 So if we start thinking about three-year, five-year,
2:45:02 seven-year, and look at what’s happening in Brevard County,
2:45:06 the multi-different levels.
2:45:08 And that’s one of the focus that I’m
2:45:10 going to have as our cabinet meeting on Monday,
2:45:12 which I had just developed late last night to ask to send out,
2:45:16 is how do we start thinking and to challenge the staff
2:45:21 and challenge me of a go-forward planning or backward planning
2:45:28 approach?
2:45:29 Because we’re at a time, do we stay the same?
2:45:34 I will not be here for any of that.
2:45:36 But we need to start getting the board
2:45:38 to start thinking in this direction by what you’re
2:45:41 raising now is, well, what about something
2:45:44 that might be done next year?
2:45:46 Other things, as you and I have chatted,
2:45:48 need to be on the hopper for the down-the-road future,
2:45:51 as once the board determines how this board sees the future.
2:45:57 So with that in mind, this one, the policy review schedule,
2:46:00 that came up at a retreat.
2:46:01 And that’s why I believe it’s on here.
2:46:05 One, my recommendation, as we’ve talked about,
2:46:08 is that the board needs to very quickly and soon review
2:46:14 and revise and then approve, adopt,
2:46:18 what your board values are.
2:46:20 We have a stated vision, mission,
2:46:23 and organizational operating principles and values
2:46:26 that, as far as we know, go back 16 years at least, maybe 20.
2:46:32 That’s been– the whole framework
2:46:34 is right there on your site.
2:46:38 But this is a newly constituted board.
2:46:42 That’s what the previous boards had instituted.
2:46:47 So I think what the board would be very healthy to do in order
2:46:50 to lay the framework for the review of your policies
2:46:54 is to now define, what are our board’s values?
2:46:59 Do we concur with the vision, the mission?
2:47:03 Do we also, with the operating principles–
2:47:06 you know it’s right there on the board site.
2:47:08 That is your fundamental piece, because idealistically,
2:47:13 ideology, philosophically, that will now
2:47:17 set everything in motion.
2:47:21 That’s what I would recommend you start on and do
2:47:23 that by March at the latest.
2:47:25 It should not take long, whether you do it by delegating it
2:47:27 to the vice chair or however you would do it,
2:47:30 or an open work session, Mr. Chairman,
2:47:33 members of the board.
2:47:34 Number two, in my judgment, I would
2:47:37 recommend that the board focus on your bylaws.
2:47:42 Section 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 2, 1 through 0, 0, 1, 7, 5.
2:47:50 And section 1,000 administration, your 10, 10,
2:47:53 your board-superintendent relationship–
2:47:55 I have that on there–
2:47:56 your development administrative regulations,
2:47:58 which we alluded to.
2:48:00 These are going to be easy.
2:48:02 And your board-staff communications–
2:48:05 these are what’s in effect now.
2:48:07 Does that align with your values and direction of the board?
2:48:10 Now, today, for example, you identified the dress code,
2:48:16 the wireless communication devices.
2:48:21 Those are the kinds of things you can cherry pick.
2:48:24 But I would suggest, as facilitated by you,
2:48:27 Mr. Chairman, that the board dig in right soon of each
2:48:32 of these things.
2:48:34 Then B, are there any new proposed policies
2:48:39 that the board wishes that you identify those?
2:48:44 We can do the draft of them.
2:48:45 We do your work.
2:48:47 I, and through our wonderful staff and board council,
2:48:50 and if we needed–
2:48:52 is it Neola?
2:48:53 Yeah, Neola.
2:48:55 We can then, if there’s such a need
2:48:57 that you exist that you think, we
2:48:59 can then develop them for you.
2:49:02 Meanwhile, the board would work through these.
2:49:06 And these were just suggested deadlines.
2:49:09 Maybe we can accelerate that, because a lot of these
2:49:11 are a one-pager, right?
2:49:14 It does two things.
2:49:15 One, set the direction of this particular board.
2:49:18 Number two, it brings you in compliance
2:49:20 with your own policy book that should be done every five years.
2:49:25 OK, number three, just make the determination,
2:49:29 and we can write the policy or amend it.
2:49:32 Do you want administrative regulations
2:49:35 from your superintendent and here forth for four years
2:49:38 going, or whenever the board changes direction
2:49:42 or composition, to have the policies purposefully brought
2:49:48 to the board for approval?
2:49:51 Of course, you do that.
2:49:52 Do you have the administrative regulations also,
2:49:54 so that you can see there’s alignment,
2:49:56 or do you want to leave it right now
2:49:58 to the discretion of the superintendent
2:50:00 whether or not they come to you?
2:50:02 I know what I would recommend.
2:50:03 I could tell you best practice is around the nation.
2:50:06 You can’t have an administrative regulation
2:50:08 that’s in discordant with that of your policy,
2:50:11 and sometimes that happens.
2:50:14 And then– and these are development of–
2:50:20 I quoted here of what I sent you, OK?
2:50:23 They’re all on the back end– the three things
2:50:25 that you had on the back here are all in bullets.
2:50:28 If everybody can take a look at them, they’re under–
2:50:30 And then what I would like to suggest, Mr. Chairman,
2:50:32 is that the board delegates to the interim superintendent
2:50:36 to facilitate and bring to the board for review, when ready,
2:50:40 the review and a revision of any policies in the book which
2:50:43 may be out of compliance with prevailing statutes.
2:50:47 And we would then bring that as soon as possible,
2:50:51 but no later in April.
2:50:52 I mean, I don’t think there are many out of compliance
2:50:54 with the way it is, but I just think
2:50:55 that that would just be a quality control
2:50:57 check for all of us and for you.
2:51:00 And also, let us take care of sections 2,000 through 9,000,
2:51:06 which would cover most of the operating–
2:51:10 unless there are things that you want to have specifically
2:51:14 your domain, you want to get into the dress code.
2:51:18 But now we’re talking facilities.
2:51:20 Now we’re talking instruction.
2:51:22 Now we’re talking the things that are right now under way
2:51:25 by our very talented staff, staff, students, finances,
2:51:30 property, operations, community relations.
2:51:33 Bring them to you, of course, for your review of any changes,
2:51:37 recommendations.
2:51:39 It’s your policies.
2:51:40 But if we can separate out the work,
2:51:43 use the expertise of these people who
2:51:46 are really good at this stuff.
2:51:49 Use the NAOLA, let me orchestrate it
2:51:51 this way of division of work.
2:51:54 The intent is to bring everything up to speed.
2:51:58 You focus on your search for your permanent superintendent.
2:52:01 And when there is the handoff, you
2:52:03 say, we now have an operational superintendent
2:52:06 feet on the ground.
2:52:08 And I’m back home.
2:52:10 Your policy book will be an administrative regulations
2:52:13 on their way or completed.
2:52:16 Thank you, Dr. Stiller.
2:52:17 I think from a perspective of the board,
2:52:19 there’s been a couple of board members
2:52:20 that have wanted to review them and see if there’s any
2:52:23 that they wanted to red flag, right?
2:52:25 I think that we have a need as a direction
2:52:29 to move forward with that.
2:52:31 So what you had mentioned in kind of a schedule–
2:52:34 so you review and revise policies book,
2:52:37 which may be out of compliance with prevailing statutes.
2:52:40 That’s absolutely the job of the staff.
2:52:43 I think does everybody here agree
2:52:45 to allow Dr. Stiller to do that according
2:52:48 to Neola and state statutes and stuff like that?
2:52:50 Are there any concerns with Dr. Stiller doing that?
2:52:54 It’s a pretty easy no brainer.
2:52:55 It should be going well.
2:52:57 The only thing that I come back to on that
2:53:00 is that we have some of these policies
2:53:01 that we did as a board look at, but we never truly updated them.
2:53:06 So it still shows that they’re like 2002,
2:53:08 even though our staff may have looked at it.
2:53:10 So if there’s a way that we can put revised or approved
2:53:15 of a specific date, then I think whatever that terminology is,
2:53:19 so that it’s updated that way, that would be great.
2:53:21 That’s a matter of paperwork of making sure
2:53:24 that everything shows the revised date
2:53:26 and approved at that time.
2:53:28 I mean, we can set that in motion
2:53:30 to people who will do this.
2:53:32 I’m sure that we have someone, Paul,
2:53:33 who does this type of work.
2:53:36 I think we can figure that out.
2:53:38 As long as the board doesn’t want to do it, so as long as–
2:53:40 They are reviewed and approved by the board March 2023.
2:53:46 So I think that’s the first thing.
2:53:47 Is everybody OK with him moving forward with reviewing
2:53:51 the staff policies, right?
2:53:52 We’re good?
2:53:53 All right.
2:53:54 Bring board review in action by period review by April 1.
2:53:58 One of the things that we looked at for dates
2:54:00 was that we as a board have a couple of dates that
2:54:03 are definitely on.
2:54:05 But if you look at the amount of dates
2:54:06 that we have as comparative to our seven day, seven day
2:54:10 notices in allowing us to get the policies completed
2:54:12 by April, we may need to add a couple of meetings
2:54:15 in between now and then so that we can
2:54:17 strike on some of those dates.
2:54:20 [INAUDIBLE]
2:54:24 No, but I mean, like he was saying,
2:54:26 he didn’t want to have it all.
2:54:28 We should be able to tell review all the policies,
2:54:32 give Dr. Shiller, hey, here’s some of the issues
2:54:34 that we’re having, right?
2:54:36 He has his administrative ones running.
2:54:38 And then we start bringing them up based
2:54:40 on staff getting a schedule at each one of the board meetings
2:54:43 for change.
2:54:45 I think that that’s part of what we’re trying to do here.
2:54:48 I think that we all have a need to try
2:54:50 to change some of the statutes.
2:54:52 And then so if you guys, if we can
2:54:54 speak specific to the dates that we may need
2:54:57 and stuff like that, is everybody OK with–
2:55:02 because here’s what my thing is.
2:55:03 If we decide to move forward with,
2:55:05 if we all go to our policies, and all of a sudden we
2:55:09 come back with 100 policies that need to be changed, right?
2:55:12 Well, that changes the amount of days
2:55:14 that we would have to come back.
2:55:16 So pre-determining dates as far as how many we may need
2:55:20 are there.
2:55:21 The other thing is that as we move forward,
2:55:23 I was going to tentatively, if we could,
2:55:26 put a couple of dates on here so that we can tentatively
2:55:28 have them.
2:55:29 And then Dr. Shiller, we can always take them off.
2:55:32 But in the event that we need them,
2:55:34 we can definitely have them.
2:55:35 Does that sound OK to everybody?
2:55:38 What I was trying to do is to kind of get you to this point.
2:55:41 This is your game plan.
2:55:43 I was just trying to accelerate it so that understanding
2:55:47 that you set what you want to be done.
2:55:49 You give me the directions as your CEO as your own policies
2:55:54 and the statutes.
2:55:56 So yes, if this is the game plan,
2:55:58 that yes, you’re going to take these and focus on less
2:56:01 those that you want to now identify to cherry pick.
2:56:04 And you say, yes.
2:56:07 See, from CEO, go forward with the staff.
2:56:10 Bring it to us.
2:56:11 We’re going to try to keep an accelerated piece going.
2:56:13 Much of what’s going to be there is
2:56:15 going to be remaining in place.
2:56:18 So the things that are really going to change, if anything,
2:56:21 is going to be what are your values,
2:56:23 what are your areas of specific intervention,
2:56:26 or how you’re going to redefine your bylaws of your operations.
2:56:31 So yes, so again, this is dependent upon you.
2:56:35 I hope this is going to be floating deadlines.
2:56:38 We do as much as we can, but that we all understand
2:56:41 is a priority for the board.
2:56:43 You’re the board.
2:56:44 You’re the policy board.
2:56:45 Thank you, Dr. Schiller.
2:56:46 So Mr. Gibbs, if we can look at what dates we currently have
2:56:52 as far as agenda dates already noticed,
2:56:55 we can kind of mirror them to set up
2:56:57 the kind of tentative policy dates that we may come back to.
2:57:02 Do you have the list of the current dates that we have?
2:57:04 I mean, I have tentatively on here.
2:57:07 Is there a way you can pull them up real quick
2:57:09 and read them in so that we can start working off of it?
2:57:12 Tammy would have the dates of our meetings, right?
2:57:14 They’re online, too.
2:57:14 I mean, I can pull them up.
2:57:15 My laptop’s just not up.
2:57:18 Yeah, can you– all right, we’ll just do this.
2:57:21 So the– yeah, no, I just–
2:57:23 I don’t have my laptop up right now.
2:57:25 So 2/7– so February 7 is the next time that we come back,
2:57:29 right?
2:57:31 Is it too early to say we can look through the policies
2:57:35 for the ones that we have concerns
2:57:37 with that we may want to change and give that
2:57:39 to Dr. Schiller by the 7th?
2:57:41 Or would you guys like to push that to the 21st?
2:57:44 So a review of the policies.
2:57:46 I’m just looking at–
2:57:49 he told us this is a suggested plan.
2:57:51 I’m just looking at the suggested plan was by February
2:57:54 7 that we would have brought to him any suggestions
2:57:57 for new policies by March that the board would have reviewed
2:58:04 our values, mission, vision, operating principles.
2:58:08 And then by April 1, we would have looked through those
2:58:10 crucial bylaws.
2:58:12 That’s– I saw on the first page that this was sent to us
2:58:16 yesterday for the signage on the folder.
2:58:18 So I agree.
2:58:18 So I– you know, I–
2:58:21 and this– all this is later, and staff’s going to work at it.
2:58:24 We have our– so I think what we need to decide is,
2:58:27 are we going–
2:58:28 what are we willing– how much are we
2:58:30 willing to get done before then?
2:58:31 So if we’re going to say February 7,
2:58:32 we’re going to come, we want to have all the bylaws looked out,
2:58:35 are we willing in the next two weeks to–
2:58:36 or goes through the bylaws, and–
2:58:38 or are we just going to wait that–
2:58:40 give ourselves a little bit more time to do that and say,
2:58:43 we’re just– any new policies we want by February 7?
2:58:45 I’m not really sure exactly what you’re trying
2:58:47 to get from us, Mr. Susan.
2:58:48 Yeah, so that’s a good question.
2:58:50 So one of the issues that we have is,
2:58:52 do we feel that by February 7, we could bring forward
2:58:56 any policies that we feel needed to be changed because
2:58:59 of our values, or whatever it is?
2:59:00 No, we’re not saying that.
2:59:01 No, I’m asking–
2:59:02 These are the new ones by February 7.
2:59:06 When you’re saying new ones, can you give specifications
2:59:08 on that?
2:59:09 Yeah, if there’s something that doesn’t exist that you think
2:59:11 needs to exist, that’s what new means.
2:59:12 He’s the one that has it.
2:59:14 What I’m thinking about is that, you know,
2:59:16 are there policies that are not currently in your book
2:59:22 that you believe need to be created?
2:59:26 What list is that?
2:59:27 Just pick one out of the sky.
2:59:30 We’ll determine if it’s there or covered.
2:59:34 And if there is new–
2:59:36 and I’m not quite sure what new may be that may not be under
2:59:40 that would just then be tweaked.
2:59:43 You’re proposing that by February 7,
2:59:45 any new ones that may not exist, we want to do, OK?
2:59:48 Just which ones are you thinking about?
2:59:51 We’ll do the research to determine whether they’re there,
2:59:54 whether they are not there, what we need to be adding,
2:59:59 and bring that back to you.
3:00:00 All I need is through you, Mr. Chairman,
3:00:03 if you survey the board, it could
3:00:04 be done in however long, an hour by each board member,
3:00:08 within an hour.
3:00:09 Yeah, look at this, Schiller.
3:00:12 You and staff look at this.
3:00:13 Do we have something?
3:00:14 And if not, we put that in a hopper to put together.
3:00:18 That won’t happen by February 7.
3:00:20 But if you, between now and your next board meeting
3:00:23 or work session, have–
3:00:26 what are they?
3:00:27 Thank you, Dr. Schiller, absolutely.
3:00:28 So the new ones, at what point, Dr. Schiller,
3:00:33 would you propose the ones that we
3:00:34 would like to change that are in current existence?
3:00:36 When would you like to– when would you say–
3:00:38 Well, that’s number– that’s letter A.
3:00:41 What I would like to suggest, that by our March meeting,
3:00:45 you then anchor down–
3:00:49 and that should not take that long.
3:00:52 What are your values?
3:00:54 What about the one page?
3:00:56 The one-liner, is that what you want to stick with?
3:00:59 So by March 7, you would like to bring forward
3:01:01 any of the changes to any of the policies
3:01:03 that we have current existing, and go through them
3:01:06 to set direction with staff is what you’re saying.
3:01:08 Well, I’m saying if you need the time,
3:01:11 by March board meeting, you would
3:01:14 have completed by revising and then approving
3:01:18 the board values.
3:01:20 If you have board values, you want to hear the vision.
3:01:24 That’s already a one standard.
3:01:26 And the mission is right behind you, is a page.
3:01:30 It’s one sentence.
3:01:32 And what the board has also up there
3:01:36 is the organizational operating principles and values.
3:01:40 If you concur with them, done.
3:01:43 If you need to change them, that’s good.
3:01:45 And then you mentioned here some of the sections that you felt–
3:01:48 Were your top priorities.
3:01:50 You felt were the top priorities.
3:01:51 Were you as a board by April 1.
3:01:54 What I would like to do is give our board the opportunity
3:01:56 to look at what their top priorities might be also,
3:01:59 that may be outside of the scope of what you brought forward
3:02:01 already.
3:02:02 Does that make sense to you?
3:02:03 Those are the new policies.
3:02:05 No, no, no.
3:02:05 So you have existing policies on our books.
3:02:08 Your bylaws.
3:02:09 That are not– that may need, our board
3:02:12 may need to look at and change.
3:02:14 That’s what your exercise would be.
3:02:16 Right.
3:02:17 So is that to be brought to you by March 7?
3:02:19 No, it says April, by April 1.
3:02:22 So you would like us to bring forward.
3:02:23 And how would you like us to bring those forward?
3:02:25 Just like you’re doing here.
3:02:27 You review, just pick one.
3:02:30 [INAUDIBLE]
3:02:33 However you want to do it, you’re the board.
3:02:35 Paul can advise, I can tell you one option that boards use
3:02:40 is that each person gets assigned
3:02:43 to something as the lead.
3:02:44 And then each board member leads the discussion
3:02:49 with the whole board of what their thinking is.
3:02:51 Other boards go forward as a committee of the whole.
3:02:55 And everyone goes through it.
3:02:57 I mean, there are ways to do it.
3:03:00 All I’m interested in, you’re the board.
3:03:02 You set the direction.
3:03:03 How you proceed.
3:03:05 But I’m trying to say, we need to get those as the foundation
3:03:08 before we build the house.
3:03:10 Building the house are the other new policies and a review
3:03:15 of extant policies.
3:03:16 If you focus on that, you built the foundation
3:03:19 of which everything else flows.
3:03:22 And you would like to have those by April 1
3:03:25 in some sort of succession order that we bring them up
3:03:27 at meetings and stuff like that?
3:03:29 I think that that would be the time frame.
3:03:31 And most of these are one liner, or they’re in statute.
3:03:35 But they’ve not been confirmed and approved and updated.
3:03:38 So I would say I agree that maybe the idea is not only
3:03:42 just one board member, but maybe what we do
3:03:44 is we take each section and assign it
3:03:47 to a specific board meeting, and then we just go through it.
3:03:50 So like you say, 1,000, 2,000, 3,000, or whatever.
3:03:53 So like February 7 is 1,000.
3:03:57 Sure, for example, the review of policy of ethics
3:04:00 is 2008 by Neola.
3:04:03 Is there anything in A, B, and C there that can be whacked out?
3:04:08 If you need technical legal assistance, we can do that.
3:04:11 So if we can do–
3:04:13 if you guys will allow me to, I’d
3:04:16 like to, since we got time certain in three minutes
3:04:18 that we wanted to take an hour break and kind of said that,
3:04:21 if I can go ahead and look at that kind of a schedule
3:04:25 and then come back after lunch and then
3:04:28 be able to offer that up to you guys of some sort of schedule
3:04:31 in that direction, if that’s OK.
3:04:32 And then we can discuss it a little bit longer.
3:04:34 And that is February 7, we review these.
3:04:37 February 21, we review these.
3:04:40 And then if there’s any that need to be– any meetings that
3:04:42 need to be added in between, we talk about that.
3:04:44 But we’re getting ready to take a break for an hour,
3:04:46 and we needed to make sure we honor what we said.
3:04:49 Is that OK with everybody?
3:04:51 OK.
3:04:53 All right, thank you very much.
3:04:55 We’ll be back at 1 o’clock.
3:04:58 [BLANK_AUDIO]
3:05:05 [MUSIC PLAYING]
3:28:49 (upbeat music)
3:29:17 (upbeat music continues)
4:06:37 (gavel bangs)
4:06:38 - Welcome back, everybody.
4:06:40 We have, everybody’s kind of making their way back in,
4:06:43 so we can kind of tentatively move a little bit forward,
4:06:46 but we’re still waiting on Dr. Schiller to go.
4:06:49 Tammy, if you can text them, let them know, hey.
4:06:52 Yeah, I think he’s- - He’s talking to Major Neal.
4:06:54 - Oh, okay.
4:06:55 - He’s in the overhang.
4:06:57 - Okay, great.
4:06:59 So, you know, while Dr. Schiller gets here,
4:07:01 just wanted you guys to take a look.
4:07:03 What we have here ahead of you right now
4:07:05 is February 7th, the 21st, the 7th, and the 28th,
4:07:08 our current meetings that we have.
4:07:10 I looked at the number of policies, stuff like that, right?
4:07:15 Like, so in 1,000 has 15 policies, 2,000 has 50.
4:07:20 And without knowing the scope
4:07:22 of how many each one of you might charge,
4:07:24 I thought that we could break it down
4:07:27 based on between 45, or like between 44 and 70, each one.
4:07:34 Okay, so I’ll explain.
4:07:35 So 1,000 policy levels are 15 of them, 2,000 is 50,
4:07:41 3,000 is 44, 5,000 is 70, 6,000 is 29,
4:07:48 7,000 is 30, 8,000 is 40, 9,000 is 18.
4:07:55 So when we look at these, what we have is,
4:08:00 is we can either do some stuff where we double them up,
4:08:03 right, and we meet on those dates,
4:08:05 or what we do is, is we push and we add some dates.
4:08:09 To be honest with you, everybody,
4:08:11 the ones that are not identified here,
4:08:13 if we do the 50 to 70 period, or a meeting,
4:08:18 are gonna be the seven, eight, and 9,000s,
4:08:20 of which I think if you look at the way those work,
4:08:23 we might be able to slide seven in with six,
4:08:26 because that’ll give us about 59,
4:08:28 and then the 8,000 and 9,000.
4:08:30 So I technically think that if we were
4:08:31 to review the policies with the fidelity that you guys want,
4:08:34 we would only need to add one more meeting to do so.
4:08:37 The problem we run into is,
4:08:40 February 14th is Valentine’s Day, right?
4:08:46 - Can I pause you for just a second?
4:08:47 - Sure.
4:08:48 - Because I hate that you did all this work,
4:08:49 that this is not what,
4:08:52 we don’t have to do it, Dr. Schuller suggested,
4:08:54 he said we didn’t have to,
4:08:55 but this is not what he suggested at all.
4:08:56 He actually says in the back that unless the board,
4:09:00 and unless there’s a specific policy
4:09:02 that a board member wants to address,
4:09:04 that he says on the back,
4:09:07 board delegates to the interim superintendent to a facility
4:09:09 and bring to the board for review on action these,
4:09:13 the 3,000s through,
4:09:15 and I guess it’s not on here right here,
4:09:16 but yes, 2,000s through 9,000s.
4:09:19 He said, he suggested, recommended that we start
4:09:24 in these coming months with the values, the bylaws,
4:09:29 those top level things,
4:09:30 and unless a board member has a new policy
4:09:34 or something specific they had,
4:09:35 like we talked about discipline or dress code, whatever,
4:09:37 that we leave that review to staff to bring to us
4:09:41 things that are out of compliance with the law.
4:09:42 So these dates, the dates are fine,
4:09:45 but what he suggested that we look at
4:09:47 is values, mission, bylaws,
4:09:51 not we’re going through the 2,000s, 3,000s, 4,000s, 5,000s.
4:09:55 I mean, if you’re suggesting we do something
4:09:56 completely different,
4:09:57 but this is not based on what he suggested.
4:09:59 - So I kind of mentioned to Dr. Schuller when we got back,
4:10:03 are you saying that we should have
4:10:04 a board member section and go through it
4:10:07 and have some sort of schedules?
4:10:08 Maybe I misunderstood, Dr. Schuller,
4:10:10 kind of what your direction was.
4:10:12 I have a feeling that we’re gonna have some board members
4:10:15 that wanna make some revisions.
4:10:17 So I don’t wanna be working, to be honest with you,
4:10:19 on a mission statement,
4:10:20 couple of things for the next four months,
4:10:22 and then just try to sort of work through it.
4:10:24 I would like to have some sort of structure as we’re moving.
4:10:27 So in the event I’m all about peers,
4:10:31 I thought this direction that we talked about going forward,
4:10:33 but Dr. Schuller, if you want to explain
4:10:35 that this is not right,
4:10:36 and there’s something else you wanna do, I’m all ears.
4:10:39 - Now, just for clarification,
4:10:41 and I’ll take responsibility if I was not clear,
4:10:44 is that it would seem to me that you could be focused
4:10:47 on your bylaws, defining your mission, vision, values,
4:10:55 and your bylaws.
4:10:57 Number one, if that’s your primary focus,
4:10:59 that’s the foundation.
4:11:02 If there are some others that you wanna cherry pick
4:11:05 in this other area, or new ones,
4:11:07 tell me what the new ones are,
4:11:08 tell me which ones you want us to review.
4:11:11 The rest of them, our staff is already underway
4:11:14 with NEOLA and reviewing the facilities and all that.
4:11:17 We’ll be bringing those to you.
4:11:20 So if you can focus on, and the bylaws are not many,
4:11:25 they’re short, and there are only a few there,
4:11:30 but it’s gonna be predicated on what you as a board believe.
4:11:34 - My question, Dr. Schuller, is drug policy,
4:11:38 volunteer policy, all of some of those ones
4:11:41 that were indicated in the past–
4:11:42 - They’re in the work right now.
4:11:44 That’s where I was out talking with Major Neal
4:11:47 about the volunteer one.
4:11:50 We’re ready to roll to the board the two options
4:11:52 for you to consider as a policy,
4:11:54 not what we’re saying, do this.
4:11:56 Okay, so we’ve got that underway.
4:11:58 We’ve already had one review.
4:12:00 Now we’re going to, I sent them back,
4:12:02 do a little bit more tweaking.
4:12:04 And what we need to do is,
4:12:06 we are not going to set the policy, you are.
4:12:08 We’re gonna give your best thinking.
4:12:10 - So I appreciate that.
4:12:12 One of the things that we had mentioned was
4:12:14 that each one of them, we would have to say we reviewed
4:12:17 and say they’ve been updated, right?
4:12:19 So how would we do that with all of us just kinda saying,
4:12:23 we’ll pick out–
4:12:24 - For you as a board, you’ll have a board,
4:12:27 let’s just take, pick one here.
4:12:30 Now, under this policy manual address is one page.
4:12:34 - Right.
4:12:35 - Boom, but it has not been addressed since 7/10/18
4:12:39 where it says revised.
4:12:40 Done, we just did it in five minutes.
4:12:42 - But what I’m saying is, is that without a structure
4:12:44 of saying we’re gonna review these 70 now,
4:12:47 that we all feel like they’ve gone through,
4:12:49 and then moving to the next 50 or 70.
4:12:51 - I don’t see where, yeah.
4:12:53 Those are gonna be staged once we know
4:12:56 what your board’s values,
4:12:58 what the mission statement is with the vision,
4:13:00 that’s your foundation.
4:13:02 What do you believe as a board?
4:13:04 You accept what all that is now, you’re done.
4:13:07 If you want to redefine that, that’s your foundation.
4:13:11 From that flows, well, some of these are just so small,
4:13:16 but the responsibility, let’s say board power,
4:13:20 this one’s a one or two line one,
4:13:22 it’s predicated on statute.
4:13:26 Member power, one sentence.
4:13:31 Is that okay?
4:13:33 Last time it was looked at was 2018.
4:13:36 - Dr. Shiller, I really appreciate that,
4:13:37 but what I’m trying to get at is,
4:13:38 is that if we look at these things,
4:13:41 and we say, okay, there’s two paths to go down, right?
4:13:43 Because you wanted to have all of the policies
4:13:46 reviewed and ready by April 1st,
4:13:48 and you wanted those bylaws and all that stuff
4:13:50 reviewed by April 1st.
4:13:51 Did I hear that correctly or no?
4:13:54 - What I think I was trying to say is that
4:13:57 if you take your piece, the board values, vision, mission,
4:14:02 and the operating principles, board values,
4:14:05 that alone by March.
4:14:09 - And all of the other policies that are out?
4:14:12 - Then by April, just the bylaws,
4:14:16 the 1000 series, and three or four more.
4:14:19 - What about all of the ones that are still 2000, 2010?
4:14:23 - And that’s what the staff will do to bring to you
4:14:27 as ready for your review,
4:14:29 and then you would approve yes or no,
4:14:33 and then they would all then be revised by 2023.
4:14:37 For example, we’ve got some going right now in facilities
4:14:40 that have gone through viola
4:14:42 that they’re about scheduled to come to you.
4:14:46 So these will have gone through the staff review.
4:14:49 - Sure.
4:14:50 - So what I’m saying is that
4:14:52 deal with the meat of the matter for you first.
4:14:59 - And I’m trying to find it, and I can’t put my hands on it.
4:15:02 Does our policy say that it is the board’s responsibility
4:15:06 to review these policies?
4:15:08 And I guess that’s, my nature is if it’s my responsibility
4:15:13 to do it, I wanna make sure that we’re laying eyes on them.
4:15:15 That’s just my personal request,
4:15:18 but I understand, obviously,
4:15:20 relying on the experts and the staff that we have here,
4:15:23 but I think that it needs to be almost in conjunction with,
4:15:25 especially if our policy is for the board to review them.
4:15:28 - The board owns the policy,
4:15:30 so the board should be the entity that reviews them
4:15:32 and gives direction on them,
4:15:34 but staff has to then write the policies
4:15:37 and bring it back for recommendation.
4:15:40 So it’s just, so the proper process is,
4:15:43 hey, board, we have a problem with volunteer.
4:15:45 - Right.
4:15:46 - Bring it before us, we talk about,
4:15:47 hey, here’s some of the things we need to change,
4:15:49 set that direction to staff,
4:15:51 staff then comes back with a revised vision and we pass it.
4:15:54 - Right.
4:15:54 - That’s, and we own all of the policies that are ours.
4:15:59 - So our policy, it’s zero–
4:16:01 - I’m trying to find it, I can’t put my hands on it.
4:16:03 - There’s a statute that also–
4:16:04 - 171.3.
4:16:05 - Yeah, 171.3, thank you,
4:16:08 says that we will, actually, there’s a whole,
4:16:11 yeah, 17.1, .2, .3, .4.
4:16:13 They all say that at least once every five years,
4:16:16 it doesn’t mean that we have to do them all at once,
4:16:18 but in the course of five years,
4:16:19 every policy will have had hands on it.
4:16:22 And you know what, the thing is,
4:16:24 and this is Mr. Seuss’s point from before the break,
4:16:27 I think what we want to have on there
4:16:29 is some of these policies, for example,
4:16:30 the board a couple years ago started in on the beginning,
4:16:32 but those beginning ones are just not really
4:16:34 a thing you’re gonna change,
4:16:35 but we didn’t put reviewed,
4:16:37 we need to add a tag that says reviewed, right?
4:16:39 So if the public knows,
4:16:41 it’s not been since 2020, 2002 that we looked at it,
4:16:45 it just had, there was nothing to revise.
4:16:48 But I didn’t hear anything in what Dr. Schuller said
4:16:51 that would keep us, in fact,
4:16:52 from doing any other policies beside that.
4:16:54 We’re gonna be doing those at the same time,
4:16:56 but I think we need to be realistic
4:16:57 with ourselves and the board.
4:16:59 It’s a lot, and it’s a lot,
4:17:02 and the part that we truly own all of it, right,
4:17:06 ‘cause we are the policy making body,
4:17:08 but we especially own the bylaws
4:17:10 because that’s establishing it.
4:17:11 So I think–
4:17:12 - We own both of them.
4:17:14 - I know, but I’m just saying,
4:17:15 the other ones are gonna rely on the area of expertise,
4:17:20 like the financial policy that we revised,
4:17:22 the investment policy we revised last year.
4:17:23 We needed the expertise of the investment people
4:17:27 to walk us through that as well,
4:17:29 and they know the laws that govern their areas, too,
4:17:31 ‘cause we can’t be making up policies out of our head
4:17:34 when it comes to stuff like that.
4:17:35 So I think, to start with the basics,
4:17:40 we’re not wasting time or spinning our wheels
4:17:43 to talk about core values and bylaws.
4:17:45 We need to start from the very beginning there,
4:17:47 especially with a new board.
4:17:48 - So I’ll bring it up.
4:17:50 We have a lot of them that are supposedly out of compliance,
4:17:53 whether they are or they’re not based on.
4:17:55 We did, we didn’t do some of them.
4:17:56 I think it behooves us to put a schedule together
4:17:59 so that we’re gonna review them.
4:18:00 Guys, feel like you don’t wanna review
4:18:01 all the policies before April 1st.
4:18:04 I’m okay with that.
4:18:05 If you wanted to go through and do whatever,
4:18:07 I personally think we can hop through the sections
4:18:11 at a time, bring ‘em forward, and move on it.
4:18:14 That’s what I thought we were gonna do.
4:18:15 - I like the schedule.
4:18:16 Personally, for me, I mean, I like that,
4:18:18 ‘cause at least it lets me know
4:18:19 what am I trying to achieve by this certain time.
4:18:21 I’m in favor of going through the policies.
4:18:23 Our policy says we’re going to review all of our policies,
4:18:25 and we haven’t done that.
4:18:26 So I mean, from a new board member perspective,
4:18:30 this is very valuable for us to go through
4:18:33 each one of these things and look at these things
4:18:35 and say, okay, this is how we’re doing it,
4:18:37 or this is what we should be doing.
4:18:38 - I just think getting all through 10 sections,
4:18:41 it will just, hundreds of policies
4:18:42 in a three-month time frame
4:18:43 that we’re also going to be interviewing
4:18:45 and hiring a new superintendent is aggressive.
4:18:47 - No doubt, we have a lot of work.
4:18:48 - So I think if we look at that and we say,
4:18:51 okay, this may be the direction of,
4:18:54 hey, these are the policies that we see in front of us.
4:18:58 These are the ones we’d like to change.
4:18:59 Can you send it off to staff?
4:19:01 And staff can then start a schedule of,
4:19:03 they’re going to come back during this time.
4:19:05 It doesn’t mean that, because there’s a couple pieces.
4:19:08 We say volunteer policy, we want to change it to X, right?
4:19:13 We want to give direction
4:19:14 on what the volunteer policy should be.
4:19:16 That then goes to the staff, staff turns around,
4:19:19 brings it back to us, and then we rework it from there.
4:19:22 Then we send it out, and then there’s seven days,
4:19:24 seven days, seven days, 14 days, all that stuff.
4:19:27 So if we were to move through a schedule where we said,
4:19:30 look, tentatively from a 30,000-foot view,
4:19:34 scan the policies, bring forward anything
4:19:35 that you want to change, we get it in there,
4:19:37 we check it off, it says that it’s been reviewed,
4:19:39 and we give it to them, then they can schedule it out
4:19:41 for the rest of the year.
4:19:43 If we don’t do something like this,
4:19:45 and come to the will of the board,
4:19:46 but if we don’t do something like this,
4:19:48 you’re looking at these, even if we just did a section
4:19:51 every meeting on the side, you’re looking at July
4:19:55 before you get to, or June before you get to all of them,
4:19:58 or May, the end of May, okay?
4:20:00 Then you’re talking about, if we just went 1,000 section
4:20:03 each time, then at the end, you’re gonna have
4:20:06 six more months of them coming up in the meetings.
4:20:09 So this right here is about a year policy.
4:20:11 If we want to extend it further, it’s the will of the board.
4:20:14 My thing was, is that, you know, I was just trying,
4:20:17 I apologize, I really thought this was what we talked about
4:20:20 ahead of time, so I would like to recommend that we–
4:20:23 - We could talk about it, it’d be awesome.
4:20:24 - Yeah, that we would go through a section at a time,
4:20:28 even if, say, April 1st is 7,000, and 8,000,
4:20:32 whatever that is, right?
4:20:33 And then what we do is we make our recommendations,
4:20:35 and if all of the ones that we reviewed are finished,
4:20:39 then the staff can say, okay, if they didn’t need
4:20:42 to be changed by Neola, they didn’t need to be changed
4:20:44 by us, then, that we didn’t make any recommendations.
4:20:47 Those policies, they get a stamp, they’ve been reviewed.
4:20:50 Boom, now we just finished 1,000.
4:20:52 Now we just finished 2,000, and we start going.
4:20:55 That would be an appropriate kind of process
4:20:58 that we can all do.
4:21:00 And that’s, and you know, staff can look over
4:21:03 all the 1,000 Neola changes as we go, too.
4:21:05 I just, that’s what I felt was a good structure
4:21:08 to get it done, and this is about a year process
4:21:11 after it’s all said.
4:21:12 So we’re gonna–
4:21:13 - Can I jump in here?
4:21:14 - Hang on, hang on.
4:21:16 So what I would do is that was my recommendation.
4:21:19 This will take about a year, but we can at least
4:21:22 get the process started in some sort of structure.
4:21:24 If we turn around and we say, let’s do the bylaws
4:21:26 in this stuff, and oh hey, just go ahead
4:21:28 and start trying to review.
4:21:29 We don’t have a structured process of these
4:21:31 have been reviewed, these are moving forward,
4:21:33 these are coming forward.
4:21:34 You know what I mean?
4:21:35 So I’m sorry.
4:21:36 Okay, Ms. Jenkins, go ahead.
4:21:37 - Yeah, I’m just, I feel like we are literally
4:21:42 reinventing a wheel that doesn’t need to be reinvented.
4:21:44 I’m not understanding, I know I’m not the only one
4:21:46 who’s been on this board already.
4:21:48 So I think the intention of Dr. Schuller bringing this up
4:21:53 was coming from a lens of his consulting frame,
4:21:57 which I respect and I acknowledge.
4:21:59 But I feel very firmly that this is the role
4:22:01 of an interim superintendent.
4:22:03 I don’t think this proposal is crazy for us
4:22:06 to go over our mission, our values, our vision,
4:22:09 and to talk about our bylaws.
4:22:11 I don’t think that’s crazy.
4:22:14 I don’t necessarily care enough to argue
4:22:17 whether or not staff needs to review the ones
4:22:20 and put like a review on them, cool.
4:22:22 That makes sense to me, fine.
4:22:24 But for us to have the schedule
4:22:25 to go through every single policy in the handbook,
4:22:27 quite frankly, makes absolutely no sense to me.
4:22:30 You have the authority as a board member
4:22:32 to bring to the attention of the superintendent
4:22:34 and the staff any policy that you wanna bring up
4:22:36 to a workshop at any point.
4:22:37 There’s no schedule.
4:22:38 You can’t say, they can’t tell you,
4:22:40 no, you gotta wait ‘til November.
4:22:41 That’s not a thing.
4:22:43 You can go up to anyone today and tell ‘em
4:22:44 you wanna talk about a plan and a policy
4:22:47 and possibly have it on the next workshop
4:22:48 as long as there’s time to advertise it.
4:22:50 And so there’s no reason for this.
4:22:53 And quite frankly, what you might find
4:22:56 as you start to learn more about our policies
4:22:58 is that there are some that you have a concern with
4:23:00 and you’re not gonna wanna wait until the month
4:23:02 that we’ve assigned to that category.
4:23:04 That doesn’t make any sense, right?
4:23:05 If it’s something that you think is an immediate concern,
4:23:07 you can bring it up when you feel like
4:23:08 you need to bring it up.
4:23:10 We do own the policies.
4:23:11 We do have to review them.
4:23:12 We have to approve them and vote on them as a body.
4:23:16 And then we’re responsible for that policy.
4:23:18 But quite frankly, there are so many things
4:23:19 that we literally know nothing about, nothing about.
4:23:24 You will not be able to read that policy
4:23:26 and find a problem with it because you won’t know
4:23:28 if there’s a problem within it.
4:23:29 And so that’s why the staff is trained
4:23:33 to follow the laws, follow NEOLA, their guidelines,
4:23:35 and bring them to us.
4:23:36 Half the time when they bring it to us,
4:23:38 if you look on the agenda,
4:23:40 and we haven’t had many meetings yet as a new board,
4:23:42 so I’m not trying to diminish what you know.
4:23:44 I’m just being honest here.
4:23:46 There’ll be many policies
4:23:47 where there’s literally no revisions.
4:23:48 It’s just state law changes.
4:23:49 It’ll say that right there in the subject for you.
4:23:52 But they’re taking care of that for us.
4:23:54 And so we gotta trust the guidance of our staff
4:23:56 and the knowledge and the professionalism of our staff
4:23:58 to do the right thing.
4:24:00 There’s no need for this.
4:24:02 Like, to be quite honest, too,
4:24:04 Mr. Susan was on the board when we did this.
4:24:05 We tried to just genuinely go through the book
4:24:08 and kind of come together at off-sites,
4:24:11 one section per month, and just say,
4:24:13 do you see anything funny here?
4:24:14 It was impossible to keep up with,
4:24:16 because again, we are not experts in most of those areas,
4:24:20 and you’re not gonna know if there’s a problem or not.
4:24:23 It’s a lot of reading.
4:24:24 It’s a lot of understanding.
4:24:25 And honestly, it becomes a burden on the staff
4:24:28 to explain policies that, quite frankly,
4:24:30 have no issues with them to us,
4:24:32 because we’re trying to find problems within them.
4:24:35 So this doesn’t make any sense to me.
4:24:38 I’m not opposed to Dr. Schuller’s proposition
4:24:43 for us to just do those things in the beginning,
4:24:45 those foundational things that we really, truly own
4:24:47 as a board, that we don’t need the expertise
4:24:49 of our staff to do with us.
4:24:51 But this is too much.
4:24:52 This doesn’t seem efficient to me.
4:24:55 We can be doing many, many, many others as a board.
4:24:58 - Ms. Jenkins, one of the issues that we have is
4:25:01 is that we have some that have dates
4:25:03 that are completely way out of whack for our review.
4:25:09 Going back to 2000, 2010.
4:25:10 - Absolutely, we’ve already covered that.
4:25:11 - And now, Ms. Jenkins, let me get to the question.
4:25:12 - No, Mr. Chisholm, no.
4:25:13 - How would under your–
4:25:14 - We already covered that.
4:25:15 We don’t need to go over that again.
4:25:16 - How under your plan would you–
4:25:16 - We have a very packed agenda.
4:25:17 We get it.
4:25:19 We have to add a reading back.
4:25:20 - How under your plan, Ms. Jenkins, if I may finish,
4:25:22 would you allow the staff to actually approve,
4:25:26 how would we be approving all of the 1000s with your plan?
4:25:29 I just wanna know.
4:25:30 - We don’t need to review them all in one year.
4:25:33 You have five years to review them.
4:25:34 The staff will take a look at them.
4:25:36 If there’s emergent issues that have to be addressed,
4:25:38 they will come forward to the board in a workshop
4:25:40 like they always do.
4:25:41 This is not a new process.
4:25:42 That is my argument.
4:25:43 It’s not a new process.
4:25:44 - One of the problems we have is that we are supposed
4:25:48 to have reviewed every policy within the five-year period
4:25:51 for staff.
4:25:52 The way it perceives is we are not allowed,
4:25:55 we’re not in compliance with that statute.
4:25:58 So we are now working on a compliance to put this together.
4:26:03 So if we go through the 1000s, we’re able to say,
4:26:06 we’ve gone through the 1000s, stamp it, and move forward.
4:26:09 But what you’re saying is that it’s okay,
4:26:11 we can move forward.
4:26:12 I’m asking you, how do we certify and make sure
4:26:15 we’re compliant with the law under your system?
4:26:19 - That’s in Dr. Schiller’s plan here.
4:26:20 That is the intention.
4:26:21 The intention is for the staff to go and say,
4:26:25 is it true we didn’t review this since 2002,
4:26:26 or is it that we just didn’t actually make a change,
4:26:29 so we didn’t vote on it and we didn’t approve it?
4:26:32 That’s the staff’s job.
4:26:33 That’s not our job.
4:26:35 We don’t know if they reviewed it.
4:26:36 We weren’t on the board long enough.
4:26:37 If there’s something that says 2002,
4:26:39 we have no idea if they reviewed it along from then to now,
4:26:42 unless we were on the board when it happened.
4:26:43 So that’s their job to come to us and say,
4:26:46 we got a problem.
4:26:47 This policy, this policy, this policy is out of compliance.
4:26:49 We need to go ahead and get into compliance.
4:26:52 They’re the ones who are gonna be the experts in that.
4:26:54 We aren’t.
4:26:55 - So I would tell you that if there are,
4:26:58 just that we own the policies.
4:27:01 And the issue that you’re running into is that
4:27:03 under your current situation, what you’re saying is,
4:27:05 is that as staff just updates ‘em
4:27:07 and we get new ones from NEOLA,
4:27:08 that’s the only time that we really need to bring ‘em up.
4:27:11 - That’s not what I said.
4:27:12 - But what I’m saying is, is that
4:27:14 under that current situation, we own these.
4:27:18 So we are the ones that actually own all of these policies.
4:27:21 And if they’re saying that they are out of compliance
4:27:23 because the dates are going back further than five years,
4:27:26 I would say we have, it behooves us to put together
4:27:28 a system that we can move forward.
4:27:30 So that’s, and however that is, is very difficult to do
4:27:34 if we’re all just throwing up like,
4:27:36 hey, I wanna change this one, that one, this one.
4:27:38 Now we still have ‘em all that say
4:27:39 that they’ve been reviewed in the back.
4:27:40 If you’re saying that allowing staff
4:27:43 to go through every one of ‘em, make the recommendations,
4:27:46 and then stamp ‘em after staff did that,
4:27:48 I have a problem with that because we as elected officials
4:27:50 are supposed to own the policies which govern us.
4:27:52 - That’s what we’ve only said.
4:27:52 - And hang on a second.
4:27:53 - What are you talking about?
4:27:54 - Everybody’s policies are different.
4:27:55 - That’s how it works.
4:27:56 - Everybody’s policies are different.
4:27:58 So in the event that we wanna change one as a board
4:28:01 and give direction to staff,
4:28:02 there’s a problem with just waiting for them to review them.
4:28:05 So what I would like to do–
4:28:06 - If you have a policy you wanna bring up,
4:28:08 you have the right to bring it up.
4:28:09 - Ms. Jenkins, can you follow the governance of the board
4:28:11 where you follow–
4:28:12 - No, Mr. Susan, you don’t follow it
4:28:13 because you rebuttal every time someone speaks
4:28:15 and you don’t allow them to come back to it.
4:28:17 It is not okay either.
4:28:18 - I wasn’t even finish speaking.
4:28:19 - You are putting words in my mouth.
4:28:21 You like to restate what people say
4:28:23 and you restate it incorrectly.
4:28:25 - Okay, how do we finish it?
4:28:25 How do we finish it? - If you as a board member,
4:28:27 if you as a board member have a concern or a policy
4:28:29 that you want to address, you just bring it up, period.
4:28:33 End of story.
4:28:34 You don’t need to wait.
4:28:36 There’s no plan to wait if you have a concern
4:28:38 that is your right and responsibility as a board member.
4:28:42 When it comes to the other things,
4:28:43 it is the staff’s responsibility to review it
4:28:46 and bring it forward to us.
4:28:48 That is their responsibility.
4:28:49 It’s how we always done it.
4:28:50 I’m gonna pose one last question to you.
4:28:52 Mr. Susan, when we had that plan to review
4:28:54 all of the policies with the last board,
4:28:59 sorry, there’s one still sitting here who can concur.
4:29:02 I don’t even know the one time you were actively engaged
4:29:05 in that conversation.
4:29:06 So don’t tell me you suddenly have a priority
4:29:08 to read the entire policy handbook.
4:29:10 Give me a break.
4:29:12 - Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
4:29:13 I would just say if the staff doesn’t review one
4:29:15 or we don’t review one, it continues to be
4:29:18 with a date of 2002 and I would like to try
4:29:20 to figure out a way to do that.
4:29:22 So in the event that we’re looking at this,
4:29:25 what I would say is is that if there’s,
4:29:27 you know, if we wanna go through all 9,000 of them
4:29:31 and throw ‘em all on the board and create that, it becomes.
4:29:33 But I think if we set sections up
4:29:36 and we go through them one at a time,
4:29:37 I think that that worked out,
4:29:38 whether we do them with some more time or not.
4:29:41 So does anybody else have anything to say?
4:29:43 Ms. Campbell.
4:29:45 - I think it doesn’t have to be clear or.
4:29:47 I think it can be both and.
4:29:49 It’s been very clear and that we, any time,
4:29:53 if there’s a particular areas of concern,
4:29:55 we address those, we brought up some areas.
4:29:57 Some of them weren’t policy areas,
4:29:58 but some at our January 9th.
4:29:59 What are your priorities, right?
4:30:00 Some of them were policy.
4:30:01 If those areas we need to address, we need to address them.
4:30:05 The law and our own policy says once every five years.
4:30:09 It’s not, it doesn’t have to all be done at once.
4:30:11 Our goal is as a board that over the next five years,
4:30:13 we can be able to say that we have looked through everything.
4:30:17 We’re already up to date with many
4:30:19 because we’ve reviewed and approved and revised
4:30:23 at least 25 policies every year
4:30:26 since I’ve been on the board and some years, a lot more.
4:30:31 What we don’t have is proof.
4:30:33 And so we can add that, just a little extra tag
4:30:35 onto the BoardDocs website that says reviewed.
4:30:39 But I don’t feel like it would be a good use of our time
4:30:42 considering all that we have to do to do this so quickly,
4:30:46 to try to do the 1000s ‘cause they are,
4:30:50 some of them are very, very long and very, very complicated.
4:30:54 So any that the staff doesn’t bring forward,
4:30:57 we have the responsibility.
4:30:58 But nothing’s telling Ms. Wright,
4:31:01 don’t read those policies until we get there, right?
4:31:03 She can be reading them and she’s already
4:31:05 hit the ground running as a board member,
4:31:07 wanna cover all the birthdays and learn all the things,
4:31:09 so proud of the way that you,
4:31:10 I’m not saying you didn’t, Mr. Trent,
4:31:12 she had a little bit longer to handle that than you did.
4:31:14 But hit the ground running.
4:31:16 That is our responsibility to that.
4:31:18 But I think we can, considering all we have to do,
4:31:20 this is, we do need to start from the beginning.
4:31:26 We need to start from the beginning.
4:31:29 And that’s what those bylaws do.
4:31:30 Because we don’t even have a great way of working
4:31:32 if we’re not there.
4:31:33 And some of them we may just go, check, nothing, we’re good.
4:31:36 Let’s add the reviewed stamp and go.
4:31:38 But I don’t see us going through
4:31:40 the whole policy book by April.
4:31:44 Even reviewing it.
4:31:46 Let’s give ourselves a little work,
4:31:48 because I’ll be honest with you,
4:31:49 we have other responsibilities as school board members.
4:31:51 This is very important.
4:31:52 But we are supposed to be in a school, by the way,
4:31:53 which is in statute, in the Constitution, I believe.
4:31:56 We have to be visiting schools.
4:31:58 We’ve got other committees that we have been assigned to
4:32:00 more than we’ve ever had before, by the way.
4:32:04 We are supposed to be out listening to our constituents.
4:32:07 I do wanna get here, and I pride myself
4:32:10 on being prepared for these meetings.
4:32:11 And I’m gonna be prepared.
4:32:13 If you say we’re gonna do the thousands,
4:32:14 and the board says we’re gonna do all the thousands today,
4:32:16 I’ll be ready when we get there.
4:32:17 But I have other things that I need to do in this role
4:32:19 to be a good, effective board member, besides just this.
4:32:22 So I can’t put my support behind
4:32:24 rushing through all this in the next four months.
4:32:29 - So I had thought that this was part
4:32:31 of the direction of the board.
4:32:32 So Mr. Trent, go ahead.
4:32:37 - Would I like to go through all the policies?
4:32:38 Yeah.
4:32:40 Being a new school board member.
4:32:43 One I understood is if it said last revised was 2002.
4:32:46 I assumed that that was the last time
4:32:48 the board approved the policy.
4:32:53 I was always open for going through
4:32:55 the thousands, the 2000s, the 3000s.
4:33:00 I’m assuming if we’ve gone through them,
4:33:03 even if it says 15 policies,
4:33:07 we may look at one or two of those
4:33:08 if we haven’t looked at it.
4:33:10 If it’s 50 policies, we might go through
4:33:12 five or six, but I’m not sure.
4:33:13 We would do our homework ahead of time
4:33:15 and no going into that which ones we haven’t looked at.
4:33:20 That’s how it was presented to me,
4:33:21 not to go through 65 policies in depth through that day.
4:33:26 I was open to any of this.
4:33:29 So again, I don’t wanna say you guys figured it out,
4:33:31 but I’m open to looking at the ones
4:33:35 that we need to be revising.
4:33:36 If it says that we need to look at them every five years,
4:33:39 if it doesn’t say within the last five years of a date,
4:33:43 and Mr. Susan, you’ve been here for more than five years,
4:33:46 you would know, and Ms. Campbell,
4:33:48 you’re here most of that time, too,
4:33:51 it’s potentially that it’s been before your time,
4:33:54 so we need to look at it.
4:33:55 And if we are responsible for doing it and not staffed,
4:33:57 then we need to do it.
4:33:58 If not, then the staff can be–
4:34:01 - We’re not just FYI, we’re not out of compliance
4:34:04 if something says last revised 2002.
4:34:07 That doesn’t put us out of compliance
4:34:09 because it’s been revised.
4:34:10 It just says we need to review them.
4:34:15 - As long as there’s some documentation
4:34:17 that we’ve reviewed these policies, that’s fine also.
4:34:20 But I’m not opposed to this, so I’m one out of five here.
4:34:25 - Okay, Ms. Wright.
4:34:27 - Okay, so I hear what everyone’s saying here,
4:34:29 and I understand this is a huge undertaking,
4:34:30 so Ms. Campbell, I hear what you’re saying on saying
4:34:32 this is, we are rushing through this,
4:34:34 and we’re trying to go faster than you’re comfortable with
4:34:36 for us to be adequately prepared
4:34:37 and actually read all these policies
4:34:39 and bring back suggestions.
4:34:40 I hear you.
4:34:42 So maybe the timeline is a little too much.
4:34:45 I will tell you from my standpoint,
4:34:47 I mean, I’m fine with committing to this timeline.
4:34:49 I’m fine with committing to extra meetings.
4:34:51 I feel like it’s very important that if our policy says
4:34:54 we have to review them every five years,
4:34:56 we need to have a system in place that shows
4:34:58 that we’ve done that, or else we’re not in compliance.
4:35:01 And I get that we’re gonna have to rely on the experts
4:35:04 and their knowledge, and so there are a lot
4:35:06 of moving components in this,
4:35:07 and it’s not gonna necessarily be as easy
4:35:09 as just, oh, you know, some of these policies
4:35:11 are gonna take some digging, and we’re probably gonna need
4:35:13 to look at law and a lot of other stuff, so I get that.
4:35:15 So if we need to slow the timeline down to some degree
4:35:19 to make everyone comfortable, I feel fine with that,
4:35:22 but I am 100% in favor of us looking at these policies,
4:35:26 because that is what our policy says we’re supposed to do.
4:35:29 And so we, and we own it.
4:35:31 So if we own it, and our name’s stamped to this thing,
4:35:33 I wanna make sure that what we’re doing
4:35:35 is complying with the law, and that it is following
4:35:37 the direction of the board that we have in place.
4:35:39 So for me, I’m on board with this,
4:35:41 but I also understand and I hear and acknowledge
4:35:43 the fact that the timeline is crunched, it is.
4:35:46 So if we need to slow it down to some degree,
4:35:49 maybe there’s a compromise that can be made there.
4:35:52 Yeah.
4:35:53 - If I can get Dr. Schiller to go,
4:35:54 ‘cause he hasn’t spoken yet.
4:35:55 Dr. Schiller. - Point of clarification.
4:35:57 The timelines I put here say period of review.
4:36:01 Doesn’t say approval, doesn’t say action.
4:36:04 It’s kind of a framework.
4:36:06 When should the review take place?
4:36:09 For example, you just said,
4:36:12 revisit the dress code policy this morning.
4:36:15 I went to 5510, there’s the dress code policy.
4:36:20 Staff will take a look at to see, since 2017,
4:36:24 the last time it was updated five years ago,
4:36:26 is there anything that we would recommend?
4:36:28 Meanwhile, you would give some input.
4:36:31 This is an area we want you to look at.
4:36:33 Pick something, I don’t know.
4:36:35 What is a particular thing that you want us to look at?
4:36:37 - Hair color. - I’m sorry?
4:36:39 - Hair color. - Hair color, okay.
4:36:42 No, it doesn’t say that purple is good,
4:36:44 but it does say pink is okay.
4:36:46 No, I’m teasing.
4:36:47 But the point being is that yes,
4:36:49 if that’s not a new policy, that’s gonna require review.
4:36:53 We can tell it to you what we think
4:36:55 in comparison to other, and NAOLA may think.
4:36:59 That’ll be a period of review that,
4:37:02 you know, what do we say, a period of review.
4:37:05 Okay, any new ones you want us to look at,
4:37:09 we will take a look to see if such a thing exists.
4:37:12 This is not that you take action on.
4:37:14 It’s not that it’s review.
4:37:18 So at least we get it in motion.
4:37:21 If you take, I didn’t say review and approve.
4:37:24 - Right. - I just said,
4:37:26 let’s try to get to the point
4:37:27 where there’s a logical way going forward.
4:37:30 You want us, if you would facilitate,
4:37:32 and I think you said yes ‘cause I wrote my notes down,
4:37:36 is to identify any proposed new policies
4:37:40 you want us to explore.
4:37:42 If you tell me next week, I want you to think about,
4:37:46 and we’ll do the research,
4:37:47 whether we have something like that,
4:37:49 that a policy can be then tweaked,
4:37:51 or if there’s something brand new.
4:37:53 That’s not a hard thing.
4:37:55 If, you know, just from the fact that you say,
4:37:58 all right, I suggest that you delegate to my position
4:38:04 to facilitate and bring to the board
4:38:06 for review and action when ready,
4:38:09 that we’ll look at all policies
4:38:10 which may be adequately compliant by April.
4:38:16 And we can then bring it to the board
4:38:18 for review and action when ready.
4:38:21 So what I’m saying is that it looks like it’s overwhelming.
4:38:26 I’m not suggesting you get it all done at one time.
4:38:28 I’m trying to get the process going
4:38:30 that there’s a logical way to review, bring forward.
4:38:34 Some of these, someone must have a record
4:38:36 when they have been previously done.
4:38:39 Well, if you’d say, all right, previously done,
4:38:42 you put your stamp on it,
4:38:43 we go through whatever number of readings
4:38:45 that has to be done that your legal counsel will tell you,
4:38:49 done.
4:38:50 So I think it’s just taking,
4:38:52 I’m trying to provide a framework.
4:38:54 If you assume, and my bad writing of it,
4:39:00 that the review meant it’s gonna be done.
4:39:04 That’s not what it’s meant.
4:39:04 It’s meant to be looked at.
4:39:06 So I think everything can get accomplished,
4:39:08 but we’re talking at each other to pass each other.
4:39:10 At least I am with you, and I apologize for that.
4:39:13 That if indeed we take chunks
4:39:18 where you could put your first stamp,
4:39:20 if you keep coming up with things of,
4:39:22 okay, maybe you need a new policy,
4:39:24 or maybe we need a tweak of dress code.
4:39:29 Now we know, then I can flesh out with you
4:39:33 what area particularly.
4:39:34 Is it hair color?
4:39:35 Is it how much exposure?
4:39:38 Okay.
4:39:39 Then we can say, okay, we need it.
4:39:41 Same thing as what I was outside before
4:39:44 talking with Major Neal about what you’re just talking about.
4:39:48 All right, we’re gonna break to the board.
4:39:50 We already had the first pass at what the working group is
4:39:55 with regard to the volunteers.
4:39:58 There’s some tweaking that might be done.
4:40:00 So what he and I was suggesting is that,
4:40:03 hey, as we go through this again,
4:40:04 it may be that we might bring two options to the board
4:40:07 for them to look at, and from a policy perspective,
4:40:11 you would then say, do we want this one,
4:40:13 or do we want that one, or some hybrid?
4:40:15 Because there’s gonna be a downside.
4:40:17 If it’s okay here, it’s not gonna be okay there.
4:40:20 So if I can speak to it, maybe the idea is,
4:40:23 and we’ve done this in the past,
4:40:25 is that we take a section a month, and we review ‘em,
4:40:28 and we meet with them and say, hey–
4:40:30 - It may not be per month.
4:40:32 - Okay. - Sorry.
4:40:33 - But for the board, if I can make a suggestion,
4:40:36 I think this is where you’re going, Ms. Schusen,
4:40:37 that we, just for our review,
4:40:42 because they are also doing all their other jobs,
4:40:44 I don’t expect staff to be ready to address every,
4:40:46 for example, the 3,000s, whatever the 3,000s are.
4:40:51 Let’s do finance, 6,000.
4:40:53 I don’t expect Ms. Slisinski to be ready
4:40:55 to answer every question for any financial policy,
4:40:57 but that we have, on the month that we say,
4:41:00 hey, this month, board, everybody read through the 6,000s,
4:41:03 we’re gonna check in, and if there’s something
4:41:06 that somebody wants to address, and we say,
4:41:07 hey, let’s take a look at this,
4:41:09 then staff starts working on it.
4:41:12 Okay, that I can agree.
4:41:13 If we can do a section a month,
4:41:15 and we say, at one of our workshops a month,
4:41:18 we have a short, five to 15-minute discussion,
4:41:22 where board members report back,
4:41:24 did anybody have a policy that just read flag to them?
4:41:28 Yes.
4:41:29 If that’s where you’re trying to go, yes.
4:41:31 That’s different from this,
4:41:33 but I think it kind of goes back
4:41:34 to what we were trying to do a couple years ago,
4:41:36 that we stopped after the first three months.
4:41:39 So I guess it was a lot to tackle.
4:41:41 - I think that’s great.
4:41:41 So what we, if I could propose this,
4:41:44 the month of February, right, we have new policies,
4:41:47 mission, values, bylaws, we start working on those, right?
4:41:50 We also take on the 15 policies of the thousand.
4:41:54 That’s within, right?
4:41:56 - That’s a whole new section.
4:41:57 Can we do that like March?
4:41:59 - The 1000?
4:42:00 - Yeah, the 1000, ‘cause the zeros are,
4:42:02 and the values are not policy,
4:42:05 and then the bylaws are in the zeros.
4:42:07 - But you don’t think we could do the new policies,
4:42:09 mission, values, bylaws, and 1000 in–
4:42:12 - And all the other stuff we have to work on as well.
4:42:14 I think that’s a lot.
4:42:15 ‘Cause I think we’re gonna have some good discussion
4:42:17 around values and missions, and I don’t wanna halt that.
4:42:19 - Okay.
4:42:22 Okay.
4:42:22 So maybe we take February and we work on new policies,
4:42:25 mission, bylaws, and values, right?
4:42:28 And then starting in March, we do 1000s, okay?
4:42:31 So that’s, the 1000s are only 15.
4:42:35 Do you wanna do one and two?
4:42:37 - If we’re gonna give an entire month,
4:42:38 is that what you’re saying?
4:42:39 - That’s what I’m trying to get to,
4:42:40 just so that we can get some sort of schedule together.
4:42:42 - I think if you’re gonna give us, I mean,
4:42:44 it’s hardly any, I’m comfortable doing more than that.
4:42:48 - So let’s propose this.
4:42:50 Let me just shoot this out there,
4:42:51 and then you guys can say that we propose that we do
4:42:54 between 50 and maybe 40 and 50 policies a month review.
4:42:59 And then what we do is we say to them,
4:43:02 hey, we’re not looking for them to come back immediately
4:43:05 to make those changes and all that stuff.
4:43:06 We as a board review them and say,
4:43:08 hey, does anybody have anything to do with the 1000, right?
4:43:12 And then somebody will say, hey, I’ve got this problem
4:43:14 with this.
4:43:15 We all say, okay, that’s good enough to move forward.
4:43:17 Go work with staff, get that thing.
4:43:19 And then when it comes back,
4:43:20 it might not come back for two months,
4:43:22 but at least it’s in the hopper and it’s moving, right?
4:43:24 And then staff has the appropriate time
4:43:26 to actually vet it, work on it,
4:43:28 and there’s no deadline on the background,
4:43:29 which is what Dr. Schiller was saying.
4:43:31 But at least we’re moving on some sort of a,
4:43:33 we’re gonna put together a schedule, all right?
4:43:36 So I think– - And in the meantime,
4:43:37 we asked board docs to add that little place,
4:43:40 if there was any, if we got through the 2000s
4:43:42 and nobody had anything,
4:43:43 that all the ones and nobody had anything on–
4:43:46 - I think Dr. Schiller can– - Add a little tag
4:43:47 that says review. - Sure.
4:43:49 I think Dr. Schiller can put that inside the thing, right?
4:43:52 Okay, so I think if we can tentatively,
4:43:56 just so he has direction,
4:43:57 because we know that he wants to have direction,
4:43:59 if we can do the new policies, mission, values, bylaws,
4:44:02 by, for the month of February, okay?
4:44:06 That’s done, that’s the zeroes.
4:44:08 And then for the month of March,
4:44:09 we do the 1000s and 2000s.
4:44:11 Is that okay with everybody?
4:44:13 - I think that’s, I’m okay with that.
4:44:15 I don’t know where everybody else is, but–
4:44:16 - The 2000s are– - It is.
4:44:18 The 2000s are 50, but if you look, 5070, right?
4:44:23 There’s some of the other ones.
4:44:24 So I would suggest that we do the 1000, 2000s.
4:44:28 Then in the month of April, we do the 3000s.
4:44:31 In the month of May, we do the 5000s.
4:44:34 We just basically take a second a month.
4:44:36 And we get through it.
4:44:37 That will put us into August/September
4:44:43 before we’ve gotten through all of them.
4:44:45 - Can we do the 6000s and 7000s together?
4:44:48 ‘Cause that would put us right around that.
4:44:50 - Look, I’m all about like going crazy.
4:44:52 - I don’t, yeah, I don’t understand what we’re doing.
4:44:55 Like, I don’t understand the why behind this.
4:44:58 - Because we haven’t reviewed the policies.
4:45:00 It sounds like this hasn’t been done.
4:45:02 - No, it has been done.
4:45:04 That’s the conversation we’re having.
4:45:06 - So let me– - So that’s why
4:45:07 Dr. Shiller is suggesting that the staff goes back
4:45:10 and figures out if things haven’t been done first.
4:45:15 That’s why he’s not tasking us with this yet.
4:45:17 Because it doesn’t make sense.
4:45:18 We’re gonna be doing double work for things
4:45:20 we genuinely don’t understand what happened.
4:45:24 We weren’t here.
4:45:25 So just let the staff review it first.
4:45:28 Because if they find out that all the 2000s are totally fine
4:45:31 and have been reviewed in the past five years,
4:45:33 we can look at it on our own leisure
4:45:35 and come back if we have a problem with the policy
4:45:37 specifically, but we don’t need to meet together too
4:45:40 and talk about it when the staff’s already talking about it.
4:45:42 And they’re the ones who are gonna have the answer.
4:45:44 I don’t understand the why behind this.
4:45:46 We’re wasting so much time on things
4:45:48 when we can be doing so much other stuff.
4:45:50 It doesn’t make any sense.
4:45:51 - Thank you, so I think that if we were to put together
4:45:54 the 1000s in the beginning, or the zeros, right,
4:45:56 and then go to the 1000s, we get through,
4:45:58 we just tentatively schedule it.
4:46:00 And then, like I think I heard somebody mumbling down there,
4:46:03 you know, maybe we get through two months
4:46:04 and we’re like, jeez, this is a lot.
4:46:06 Or, hey, no, this is okay, we’re okay to go.
4:46:08 Then we just make an adjustment.
4:46:10 So I think that if we can at least just say,
4:46:12 for the next three months, we’re gonna go over X, Y, and Z,
4:46:15 then we come back as we’re getting through them
4:46:18 and say, wow, this is a lot, right?
4:46:20 Maybe we need to stretch it a little bit.
4:46:22 But that allows us to, every single time
4:46:25 we get through one of those sections,
4:46:26 to say this section’s been revised,
4:46:28 put that date at the bottom, and we move on.
4:46:30 It also works with you, with your,
4:46:32 you know what I mean, with the timeframe that we do.
4:46:34 And to be honest with you, I think we are all excited
4:46:37 to move, right, but we do have some other issues,
4:46:40 which I was gonna just bring up after this,
4:46:41 that we had already identified in our offsite
4:46:43 that we also wanna try to get taken care of, right?
4:46:45 So this works.
4:46:47 So if we can tentatively just basically take
4:46:52 a different section and like, so you take zeros for February,
4:46:58 ones and twos for March, threes for April, right?
4:47:04 Fives for May, sixes for June.
4:47:09 If you want to, we can double it up.
4:47:12 So sixes and sevens for June, and then eight for July,
4:47:17 and then finish out nines in August.
4:47:21 And then, I think so, I think we can do it.
4:47:24 But if we just tentatively stretch that right there,
4:47:27 and then we say, okay, let’s go ahead
4:47:29 and send that to Dr. Schiller.
4:47:30 He can then put it together inside
4:47:32 of an agenda format appropriately.
4:47:34 Because we’re pretty much gonna take half and half,
4:47:37 which is what I was thinking.
4:47:39 If there’s 70 of them, you have two meetings just,
4:47:41 so like you just take the first half, 35,
4:47:43 and then the second half, 35.
4:47:45 But it’ll get, at least tentatively we do that,
4:47:47 and we can adjust it if we need to,
4:47:49 if we start getting involved.
4:47:51 Because if you look at some of them, you guys,
4:47:53 they’re like one paragraph, one sentence.
4:47:55 It’s like, it starts to get to a place,
4:47:57 but if we can tentatively do that–
4:47:58 - Can we move on to the rest of this agenda
4:47:59 that’s so much more important, please?
4:48:01 - Ms. Jenkins, we’re just trying to get down
4:48:03 to the bottom of this piece.
4:48:04 Thank you. - No, it’s like,
4:48:05 it’s enough. - So the other thing
4:48:06 that we wanted to talk about was,
4:48:08 we had a series of off-site requests
4:48:12 that were volunteer statute, all that stuff, right?
4:48:16 So when I met with Dr. Schiller, I said,
4:48:19 hey, technically, we should give all of our requests
4:48:22 to staff, and then staff would be able to tell us
4:48:25 when the appropriate time to bring those up.
4:48:27 Because we can’t bring them all up right now, right?
4:48:29 But there’s one for budget.
4:48:30 If we don’t get moving on the budget earlier,
4:48:33 it starts coming like in March, April, May, right?
4:48:36 We start talking in March about capital budgets,
4:48:38 we start doing that stuff.
4:48:39 So we want to kind of move that.
4:48:41 So what I would, if it’s okay with everybody,
4:48:43 I would like to give Dr. Schiller and staff
4:48:46 the list of them, and say, hey, Dr. Schiller,
4:48:48 can you go ahead and take our board request,
4:48:50 and go ahead and figure out where appropriately
4:48:53 inside the meetings over the next couple of months that is,
4:48:55 and then he can come back with us.
4:48:57 Does that make sense?
4:49:01 - The only problem, and I’m just gonna go back
4:49:02 to our school board working guidelines on this.
4:49:04 We didn’t, I mean, how much of those things
4:49:07 do we need to have agreement, or at least consensus of three
4:49:10 before we ask staff to put a lot of time,
4:49:13 ‘cause some of those things we said,
4:49:15 kind of were headin’ on around the table,
4:49:16 and some things were just, because it was just,
4:49:18 hey, what’s your priorities?
4:49:19 It was just something that Matt Susan was interested in,
4:49:22 or something that Jean Trent was interested in.
4:49:25 So I don’t want staff to go run around spending
4:49:28 a lot of time in something that the rest of the board
4:49:30 might not be interested in.
4:49:31 - Well, I’ll be honest with you,
4:49:33 we all gave board direction that it was okay
4:49:35 to tackle those topics, but the other thing that I realized
4:49:38 when I met with, well, we did, we said,
4:49:40 is everybody okay with this?
4:49:41 The other thing that I said was there’s a lot of them
4:49:46 that don’t even pertain to a board meeting.
4:49:48 Like, there’s some that aren’t even a part of that.
4:49:50 The other thing is is that a lot of them,
4:49:53 we’re already gonna be reviewing inside of our policies.
4:49:55 Like, the volunteer situation, already a policy.
4:49:58 The HR stuff, already a policy, right?
4:50:00 So like, we’re already gonna be tackling them.
4:50:03 So if it’s okay with you guys,
4:50:04 I would like to work with Dr. Schiller and staff
4:50:06 on presenting a schedule that you guys may approve
4:50:09 that’s tentative, and we just looked at it
4:50:11 to tackle the board’s needs.
4:50:12 Does that make sense?
4:50:14 - I mean, if we’re gonna look at it ahead of time, isn’t it?
4:50:18 - There’s nothing definite, but at least it’ll allow us
4:50:21 on February 7th to bring forward a schedule over the next,
4:50:23 because truly, and then the next step is,
4:50:26 we said some things in there,
4:50:27 and then Tammy was asking me, she said,
4:50:31 “Hey, Matt, what does this mean?”
4:50:32 And I was like, “I don’t know, Gene brought that up.”
4:50:33 You know what I mean?
4:50:34 He talked about, and we discussed it, we gave approval.
4:50:37 We said, “Hey, is everybody okay with this?”
4:50:38 We moved forward, yep.
4:50:39 But that’s where that form came from.
4:50:41 So Ms. Tammy emailed all of you guys a tentative form,
4:50:45 and what that is is the who, what, when, where, why
4:50:48 of each one of the topics that we brought forward.
4:50:50 It’s a very good practice so that staff knows
4:50:53 what the heck we’re talking about, right?
4:50:55 So like, mine was like ROTC.
4:50:58 I can put in there, we want to maybe expand
4:51:01 the ROTC programs in each one of the schools,
4:51:03 here’s what it is, and put it in a form.
4:51:05 We can bring those back on February 7th
4:51:07 to make sure that everybody’s okay
4:51:08 with a tentative schedule, and then we can work through it,
4:51:11 and if there’s any that you’re like,
4:51:12 “Look, I don’t want to touch this thing,”
4:51:13 then we vote on ‘em, I’m okay with trying
4:51:15 to get ‘em eliminated, you know what I mean?
4:51:17 Does that make sense to you?
4:51:18 - Just make sure what you said,
4:51:19 we had consensus what we had agreed to.
4:51:22 - So we had, on the off-site meeting,
4:51:23 we identified, I think it was 11 topics
4:51:26 that we all agreed that we would tentatively look at, right?
4:51:29 So many of those are–
4:51:30 - I’m gonna pause you right there,
4:51:31 because when we had that meeting,
4:51:33 it was my understanding, and go back to the email
4:51:35 that Ms. Seperius sent us, that said,
4:51:38 “Everybody bring your priorities.”
4:51:41 And we all just, it was just an open forum.
4:51:43 It was just, “Hey, what are you interested in?
4:51:44 “What do you want to see done?”
4:51:45 And we just put it out there.
4:51:47 And it was even specifically given instructions and email.
4:51:50 We’re not gonna have a lot of discussion with this,
4:51:51 we’re just gonna make a list.
4:51:53 - Okay, so were there anything–
4:51:55 - I don’t believe that we agreed to anything,
4:51:57 except we’re gonna talk about it.
4:52:00 - Well, I think that we had said,
4:52:01 “Does this throw a red flag on anybody?”
4:52:03 And if anybody doesn’t agree with this,
4:52:05 then we should red flag it now,
4:52:07 but we would like to move forward with it.
4:52:09 And I think, like I said, almost a third of them
4:52:11 aren’t even topics that we probably need to bring
4:52:13 before a board workshop.
4:52:15 A third of them are already policies we’re reviewing.
4:52:18 So what I would say is, is that if you looked at those 11,
4:52:22 and any of them cause you heartburn,
4:52:24 or something like that, absolutely, like bring that up.
4:52:27 And I think that on the 11th, on the February 7th,
4:52:29 would be the appropriate time to do that.
4:52:32 - Yeah, ‘cause there were some that I wasn’t quite,
4:52:34 there were some that I wasn’t quite all on board yet.
4:52:36 I certainly couldn’t have given you my opinion
4:52:38 without having done the research.
4:52:39 So I just want to be careful,
4:52:40 because sometimes we say things and you come back,
4:52:42 “Oh, we have consensus.”
4:52:43 I just want to make sure I’m very clear
4:52:44 of what you’re saying we have consensus on today.
4:52:47 - And I would say that if there’s anything
4:52:48 that causes the majority of the board
4:52:50 that they don’t want to move forward,
4:52:51 then I think that they won’t move forward.
4:52:53 I think that we have to take that 11,
4:52:55 we have to put some sort of definition behind it,
4:52:58 and then we have to bring that to Dr. Schiller
4:52:59 to bring forward in sort of a tentative schedule.
4:53:02 And then all we have to do is review that,
4:53:03 talk about it, and move forward.
4:53:04 We can do that on the 7th.
4:53:06 It’s kind of the same direction
4:53:07 that we were given when we did.
4:53:08 So, is everybody okay with–
4:53:10 (muffled speaking)
4:53:15 So they’re in our minutes that are already here.
4:53:17 - They’re in the board hub, but it’s hard to find it.
4:53:19 - Well, also, in your minutes that you have
4:53:21 that we’re approving tonight, they’re inside of there.
4:53:23 - Okay.
4:53:25 - Did you need to review that prior to us saying
4:53:27 that we’re gonna bring them back on the 7th,
4:53:29 or are you guys okay with bringing them back?
4:53:31 - So, I’m with Katie here.
4:53:34 And again, I feel like, what are we doing?
4:53:37 This is not how the board functions.
4:53:39 If you’re a functioning school board member,
4:53:40 you are actively talking to your superintendent
4:53:42 and your staff about your concerns.
4:53:44 You’re actively learning about your concern.
4:53:47 Then you come to the board in a public board meeting,
4:53:49 and you can bring that up in a discussion
4:53:51 to your fellow board members if there’s a consensus
4:53:53 whether or not they want to visit your concern.
4:53:56 That’s when the staff spends time on it
4:53:58 and brings it forward in a workshop.
4:54:00 That’s how a board functions.
4:54:03 You can’t pre-predict the next 12 months
4:54:05 what we’re gonna talk about
4:54:06 and what’s more of a priority over another.
4:54:08 You just can’t.
4:54:09 It doesn’t make any sense.
4:54:10 I don’t understand this imaginary scheduling
4:54:13 we’re trying to do.
4:54:14 It’s so restrictive and controlling,
4:54:17 and it doesn’t make sense.
4:54:18 We’re fluid, we’re a fluid government organization.
4:54:21 We should be moving with the needs of our school system
4:54:25 and your own personal priorities, absolutely.
4:54:27 You can interject them there if there’s time for it, sure.
4:54:30 But this makes no sense.
4:54:32 We brought up at that meeting about the volunteer.
4:54:35 That’s a need of our community
4:54:36 that we keep hearing over and over and over again.
4:54:38 We don’t need to have a schedule
4:54:40 that we need to go look at
4:54:40 and say when we were supposed to have a conversation about.
4:54:42 It doesn’t make any sense.
4:54:43 You bring it up to the superintendent,
4:54:45 you bring it up to the staff,
4:54:46 you bring it up to the public.
4:54:47 You move on.
4:54:48 That’s how we roll.
4:54:50 Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
4:54:51 The topics that we decided, they’re in the thing,
4:54:54 and I can do it right here.
4:54:55 Mental health, policy review schedule, which we’re doing,
4:54:59 communications to families,
4:55:00 like how we’re gonna communicate to them,
4:55:02 budget process and transparency,
4:55:04 discipline, which we tackled,
4:55:06 HR protocols, which dealt with transfers
4:55:08 and some other things, K through three reading levels,
4:55:11 and tying some sort of achievement to that,
4:55:14 progressive career and technical alignment plan,
4:55:17 ESF staff substitutes in schools,
4:55:21 lobbyist registration, meeting advertisements
4:55:23 in county-wide website,
4:55:24 advertising to increase revenue partnership with county,
4:55:28 volunteerism, volunteer registration program,
4:55:31 student attraction plan, evaluation of BPS jobs,
4:55:34 ROTC review and expansion, and employee award.
4:55:37 Now, when I look at these employee awards,
4:55:40 like I said, a third of these aren’t even topics
4:55:43 that we technically need to bring up in front of the board.
4:55:46 We can work on those on the side.
4:55:47 Many of these are already moving,
4:55:50 and many of them we’re gonna be tackling anyway.
4:55:52 - And many of those are super broad.
4:55:54 - I have a comment on the side part,
4:55:55 because if on the side part means that you as a board member
4:55:58 go to staff and tell them to start doing something,
4:56:00 I have a problem with that,
4:56:01 because if that was not the direction of the board,
4:56:04 yeah, you know why it doesn’t need to become
4:56:05 a board meeting?
4:56:06 Because it’s not board business, it’s operations.
4:56:09 A lot of these are operational,
4:56:11 and I will tell you, we have policy, we have budget,
4:56:15 we have provision of the superintendent,
4:56:18 and our other entities that work directly to us,
4:56:20 but then the other side,
4:56:21 the superintendent has the operational side,
4:56:23 and a lot of this is operational.
4:56:24 And on the other side, hearing a lot of the public saying,
4:56:27 there’s some big things we’re tackling, right?
4:56:28 Discipline, and all that.
4:56:30 Then I don’t feel comfortable with us saying,
4:56:34 because it kind of sounds like the way you’re saying is,
4:56:36 it doesn’t have to come before the board,
4:56:37 we can just start work.
4:56:38 We, like we, maybe individually,
4:56:40 I have my pet things I want working on it.
4:56:42 I can go to staff and say,
4:56:43 hey, staff, I want you to do this,
4:56:44 ‘cause this is my pet thing.
4:56:46 That’s not okay.
4:56:47 One of us individually, as board members,
4:56:50 should not be going to staff saying,
4:56:51 you need to be doing this, or I wanna see this happen.
4:56:54 That causes problems.
4:56:55 We make those decisions, we set that direction as a board.
4:56:59 So if it’s operational,
4:57:01 and really falls under the responsibility
4:57:02 of the superintendent,
4:57:04 then we can individually go to the superintendent and say,
4:57:08 hey, Mr. Superintendent,
4:57:09 I really would like to see expansion of,
4:57:14 where did it go, somewhere, athletics.
4:57:16 Can we talk about that?
4:57:17 Can you set a board workshop
4:57:20 so we can talk about athletics,
4:57:21 and we can have that conversation as a board.
4:57:23 But you as an individual board member
4:57:25 should not be going to staff saying,
4:57:26 let’s get this plan in place.
4:57:28 That is absolutely horrible governance.
4:57:30 It’s out of line,
4:57:31 and it is not fair to the other board board members.
4:57:33 - Ms. Jenkins, at no point was I mentioning
4:57:35 that we were going to literally start doing,
4:57:38 or Ms. Campbell, I’m telling you right now,
4:57:41 there is no, your board cannot act on its own.
4:57:44 What I was saying is, we brought these up,
4:57:46 I thought we had board direction,
4:57:47 but if we have to bring them up on February 7th,
4:57:49 that’s fine too.
4:57:51 But in the event that we say,
4:57:52 yeah, that works out real well, employee awards,
4:57:55 what I can do is go work with staff after we say it’s okay,
4:57:58 and then staff can identify,
4:57:59 yeah, these are some good ideas,
4:58:00 and then bring them back to us.
4:58:02 So at no point have I ever said
4:58:04 that we needed to move forward
4:58:05 without the direction of the staff.
4:58:07 I’ve consistently said that.
4:58:08 That was interpreted the wrong way, I apologize.
4:58:11 So the idea is, is that we can bring these seven,
4:58:13 or all of these back to us on February 7th
4:58:17 for approval and a date that they may be moving forward.
4:58:20 All we’re trying to do is set up a schedule
4:58:22 to identify some of these,
4:58:23 and some of them we’ve already started attacking,
4:58:26 and some of them are already on the agenda
4:58:28 for February 7th.
4:58:29 Is everybody okay with bringing these forward,
4:58:33 setting a tentative plan,
4:58:34 just like we did with the other pieces,
4:58:36 and moving forward,
4:58:37 and in the event that Ms. Campbell doesn’t like,
4:58:39 and Ms. Jenkins or Jean Trent doesn’t like one,
4:58:41 then we’ll discuss it there, and we can eliminate it.
4:58:43 Is that okay with everybody?
4:58:45 - No, I think it’s a waste of time,
4:58:46 because the purpose of that conversation
4:58:47 that created that list wasn’t for this end goal.
4:58:52 The things you just read off,
4:58:54 many of them are the most broad things in the world,
4:58:56 like mental health.
4:58:58 What does that even mean?
4:58:59 You have to have a specific purpose
4:59:01 to come together and call the staff together,
4:59:03 and you can talk about that whenever you want to,
4:59:05 like I’ve said time and time again.
4:59:07 Why are we creating a fake schedule of something
4:59:09 that we don’t have buy-in to?
4:59:11 It doesn’t make sense.
4:59:13 We’re a board of governance.
4:59:14 If you have a concern, bring it up, address it.
4:59:19 We don’t need to pre-plan something
4:59:20 that we had a discussion to tell
4:59:22 our new interim superintendent our personal priorities.
4:59:25 That was the point of that conversation.
4:59:28 It was to have a conversation with the interim.
4:59:30 It wasn’t to plan what we’re gonna talk about
4:59:32 and tackle over the next year.
4:59:34 That was not the point of it.
4:59:35 And so, no, I do not approve.
4:59:38 - So, Ms. Jenkins, I would say that mental health
4:59:39 is one of the worst situations
4:59:41 inside of our school district–
4:59:42 - Mr. Susan, of course it is! - And actually having
4:59:43 a discussion as a group– - Stop remodeling everything!
4:59:45 You need to take a minute and listen.
4:59:48 - Please let me finish when I speak.
4:59:49 - Of course mental health is important.
4:59:52 Putting mental health on a schedule to discuss
4:59:54 with no plan makes literally no sense.
4:59:55 - So, Ms. Jenkins, I would say that mental health
4:59:57 is literally one of the biggest issues.
5:00:00 We need to tackle it as a group.
5:00:01 I put it down there to give direction to staff
5:00:03 to go ahead and do it.
5:00:05 So, thank you very much.
5:00:06 Do I have a board majority to bring back these topics
5:00:08 and talk about a schedule?
5:00:11 - Yeah, those topics talk about, I’ll say,
5:00:13 I’m in favor of– - Mr. Trent?
5:00:17 - In favor of what, in favor of talking about them?
5:00:18 - Yeah. - Okay.
5:00:20 I just wanna, that’s why I’m not clear.
5:00:22 What are we doing?
5:00:22 What are we giving direction to?
5:00:23 - Let me give some better explanation.
5:00:27 So, I would like to take each one of these,
5:00:30 have a form filled out by the board member,
5:00:33 submit them to Dr. Schiller.
5:00:35 Dr. Schiller will have all of these.
5:00:37 He will then say, okay, tentatively,
5:00:39 we can put a schedule together that looks like these things.
5:00:42 So, budget is right before the budget.
5:00:45 ESE, or CTE, the month of February is the CTE month,
5:00:50 and we can promote that, and we can get out there,
5:00:52 and we can do stuff.
5:00:53 So, he puts that together.
5:00:54 He brings that back before the board.
5:00:57 We then say, okay, now I’ve read the form.
5:01:00 I understand what Mr. Susan said about mental health.
5:01:02 Now, is that what we wanna do?
5:01:04 And then, we either decide to not do it or do it,
5:01:07 and then we move on, and we have a schedule in place
5:01:09 so that we can start attacking ‘em.
5:01:11 That’s it.
5:01:12 It’s not outside the box.
5:01:13 It’s giving board approval.
5:01:16 - That is what I was asking for,
5:01:17 because it sometimes sounded like you were saying
5:01:19 that we all agreed to do this.
5:01:20 - Well, I promise you, Ms. Campbell,
5:01:22 I promise you that is not the case, okay?
5:01:24 I promise you that the board will give direction,
5:01:26 and I promise you that that’s the direction
5:01:28 that I’d like to go, okay?
5:01:30 We all good?
5:01:31 All right.
5:01:33 Oh.
5:01:35 Let me get back to what the next topic is.
5:01:43 - Can we, I brought this up in the past,
5:01:44 but this is something we need to talk about as a board.
5:01:47 Going forward– - Ms. Jenkins,
5:01:48 is it on the agenda? - We need to report
5:01:49 every meeting, whether it’s offsite or not.
5:01:51 - Is this on the agenda? - It needs to be recorded.
5:01:53 I don’t care if it’s on the agenda, Mr. Susan.
5:01:56 - Okay, thank you.
5:01:57 So, the next one that we have
5:01:59 is the interim reorganization plan recommendations.
5:02:03 Dr. Shiller, I think this is inside your boat,
5:02:05 if you would please bring it forward.
5:02:07 - Yes, ladies and gentlemen, when,
5:02:10 as part of my contract was a study of the conditions
5:02:13 of the district, and to make recommendations thereof.
5:02:18 To that end,
5:02:23 I’ve done that, and there are two things
5:02:25 which needed immediate attention,
5:02:28 and that was that we had two top-level retirements.
5:02:33 What I’m recommending to you is replacements
5:02:36 for those two people, and I went through the process
5:02:39 with regard to interviewing internal,
5:02:43 looking at external, with the help of,
5:02:46 with the gracious help of your search consultant,
5:02:49 was able to identify a very outstanding person,
5:02:53 or people, for several positions.
5:02:57 What I’m trying to do two things,
5:03:00 as I laid out for you in these five pages,
5:03:04 is that, one, there’s a position of chief human resources.
5:03:09 We had three BPS employees apply, Dr. Thiede’s screen,
5:03:13 and I interviewed all three,
5:03:15 and I’m recommending, for your consideration tonight,
5:03:17 concurrence with an internal candidate
5:03:19 who is the best qualified for this position,
5:03:22 and willing to serve on the interim capacity,
5:03:24 along with the concurrent, ongoing responsibilities,
5:03:29 and that is Dr. Green.
5:03:31 Secondly, a highly experienced administrator,
5:03:37 both in Orange County and Pinellas County,
5:03:42 had contacted me at the last moment, per se,
5:03:46 and asking if there’s a way in which, perhaps,
5:03:51 she may offer her services.
5:03:53 After extensive interviewing, reference check,
5:03:57 spent three hours together.
5:04:00 I have an internal candidate, Dr. Webley,
5:04:05 and who brings a skillset that is not necessarily
5:04:08 going to duplicate what the outstanding skillset
5:04:11 and experience of our five directors,
5:04:14 or six directors, when I was meeting with them
5:04:16 in my office last week for an hour.
5:04:19 We were talking, and I may be off by a few years,
5:04:21 31 years, 23, 27, and so forth, they know the business.
5:04:28 Dr. Sullivan was kind enough to volunteer,
5:04:32 since I was between a rock and a hard place,
5:04:36 so she would take on those additional responsibilities
5:04:38 when Ms. Moore departed, and she did for two weeks,
5:04:42 and I thank her publicly for doing that,
5:04:44 but I’m also very pleased that Dr. Webley
5:04:46 brings a skillset, particularly her analytical
5:04:49 and synthesis skills, to be able to help right away
5:04:53 with the discipline issue, and with all of the kinds
5:04:57 of things that we’re talking about,
5:04:59 and then to coordinate and supervise the various people
5:05:02 who are doing the field work out there.
5:05:05 Ms. Bland and everyone else, Ms. Jenkins and other folks
5:05:08 who are so fine at what they do.
5:05:11 So I’m suggesting that with your concurrence,
5:05:15 these folks are ready to go.
5:05:17 Ms. Green has been, Dr. Green has been serving
5:05:21 in a designee role for the last several weeks
5:05:24 until Dr. Thede’s contract expired,
5:05:26 doing the yeoman work of putting everything together.
5:05:30 So I’m asking for tonight that you would approve
5:05:33 those two replacements.
5:05:35 Meanwhile, and again, thank you to Dr. Thede,
5:05:38 and thank you to the many hours of Dr. Mullins,
5:05:41 and gauging their advice and thinking,
5:05:43 and what Dr. Mullins’ plan was with the millage
5:05:47 passing and with whatever, that in truth,
5:05:51 he has been wanting a deputy, you might call it
5:05:55 a chief academic officer, who will be able to help work
5:05:59 with our three assistant superintendents to coordinate
5:06:02 and making sure that the individual areas of elementary
5:06:06 and secondary and support services are integrated,
5:06:10 going directionally, as well as this particular individual
5:06:15 who Dr. Vogel had identified,
5:06:19 ‘cause he is your search consultant,
5:06:21 I did some national search, no one will come for four months,
5:06:25 so to speak, and come here, and then,
5:06:28 being that this whole thing disappears,
5:06:30 and these positions disappear when your new permanent
5:06:32 comes in, and I’m hopeful that the new permanent would,
5:06:36 and I would recommend, take a real hard look
5:06:39 at the fine work that the staff who are now in place
5:06:42 are doing, so they can determine the interim and the board,
5:06:45 whether you want these folks to continue
5:06:48 with a reappointment or have other plans as a board.
5:06:52 For me, I need a structure, and I need folks
5:06:55 who know their work from within,
5:06:57 complimented by someone from outside.
5:06:59 Dr. Vogel had identified the very best candidate
5:07:04 coming from a long-time position of deputy
5:07:07 for educational excellence and equity and diversity,
5:07:13 Dr. Anna Maria Cote, she also has the benefit
5:07:18 of her vested interest, she has children, grandchildren,
5:07:21 who live here and are attending our schools.
5:07:23 She wants to come out of retirement,
5:07:25 the comfort level of home after many years,
5:07:28 and be part of this to help out at this point in time.
5:07:32 Again, Dr. Cote’s appointment will only last
5:07:36 until such time that it disintegrates upon my departure,
5:07:41 or your determination, until the operational person
5:07:45 makes a determination, and so does the interim reorganization.
5:07:51 So basically, what I’m trying to do
5:07:54 is to have an organization.
5:07:57 That’s concurrent with the thinking that Dr. Mullins had.
5:08:01 His preference was to have two deputies,
5:08:03 and as I explained here, with a district of 78,000,
5:08:07 the best practice is around nation.
5:08:09 It’s when you get to over 100,000,
5:08:11 you get two deputies, one for operation, and one for.
5:08:17 However, there’s clearly that I have a need for,
5:08:20 we all have a need for, someone about 20% of the time
5:08:25 to be the glue, the chief of staff,
5:08:28 where we can have a lot of things run through
5:08:31 so they’re not just coming through me.
5:08:34 I find that Mr. Russell Bruhn, who you know,
5:08:37 typically chief of staff is just that.
5:08:39 He’s going to continue doing the very elements
5:08:42 of a chief of staff, the strategic communication,
5:08:46 the legislative liaison work,
5:08:50 and also to be able to take on not only what he’s doing,
5:08:55 but not supervising any chiefs, but in a staff role.
5:09:00 Because he’s doing that now, informally,
5:09:04 with the legislative piece, with the ongoing kinds of things
5:09:08 and things that come in on a daily basis
5:09:10 that I need to refer to follow up on,
5:09:14 so he can coordinate that.
5:09:15 And also, again, he’s going to continue doing
5:09:20 what he’s doing on his portfolio,
5:09:23 taking on additional work, and that is being that person
5:09:27 who I can say, okay, work with Mr. Wilson.
5:09:30 Work with this, see that this particular matter
5:09:33 that’s coming in that a parent is raising or whatever,
5:09:36 and is going out to Dr. Klein and Dr. Sullivan and so forth,
5:09:42 keep it rolling.
5:09:44 There are two other things, or three other things
5:09:46 that I’m recommending to you on an interim basis.
5:09:49 Given the fact that a number of states,
5:09:52 like Texas and others for years now,
5:09:54 have required that the director of safety
5:09:56 and security position not be part of the chain,
5:10:03 but directly report to the chief executive officer,
5:10:07 so that I’m recommending that during this period of time,
5:10:11 that our director of safety and security
5:10:13 be a direct report to me.
5:10:16 There are things that have happened like over this weekend,
5:10:18 or things that I was just conferring with,
5:10:21 and that’s why it was a little late coming in,
5:10:23 that have happened, I need to hear right away.
5:10:26 As does Mr. Bruin, so he can then handle,
5:10:29 as does the kinds of things that the staff
5:10:32 is handling routinely every day,
5:10:34 and I have to tell you, as a tribute to this,
5:10:37 to the finely oiled machine that Dr. Mullins put together,
5:10:42 these people attend to business.
5:10:45 We have some incidents, all of them been reported to you.
5:10:50 They know how to handle these matters,
5:10:52 they know how to communicate.
5:10:54 I’m in the loop, your communication’s in the loop,
5:10:57 and we’re trying to make sure you’re in the loop
5:10:59 as far as we know.
5:11:01 It’s, that’s working so well because of the protocols,
5:11:06 the experience, and that these people,
5:11:09 I get calls from, which I love,
5:11:12 one o’clock in the morning, five o’clock in the morning
5:11:14 from Mr. Wilson with regard to the transportation,
5:11:18 where we are, or how we’re doing, or what bus is down.
5:11:22 I need that, you want me to have that.
5:11:24 They all report to me per se,
5:11:26 but I need some kind of additional assistance.
5:11:30 Mr. Bruin and the chief, for example,
5:11:34 there are a couple of difficult personnel matters
5:11:37 that have emerged for the last couple of days.
5:11:42 Heaven forbid we had a Uvalde or a Stoneman Douglas.
5:11:46 On behalf of the safety of your staff and students,
5:11:49 I want to know, as soon as the director knows,
5:11:55 that we can be there on site so that we can protect
5:11:58 the best interests of the children.
5:12:00 During my term, as well as the safety of our staff,
5:12:03 yes, coordinating with the sheriff will take care
5:12:06 of all the tactical aspects,
5:12:08 but I just don’t want anything, heaven forbid,
5:12:11 to occur during my watch or in your district forever,
5:12:15 and that there’s any kind of a breakdown there.
5:12:17 That’s why I’m recommending that particular move
5:12:21 of the director’s report for this period of time.
5:12:23 What you do thereafter, what the person who comes in here,
5:12:27 whether she or he wants to continue,
5:12:29 this is off the books after I leave.
5:12:32 The other thing is things that, technically,
5:12:35 is a code transfer, and those are two positions,
5:12:40 not people, but positions,
5:12:42 that have district-wide responsibility.
5:12:45 One, athletics and activities that affects
5:12:48 maybe 8,000, 9,000 students,
5:12:51 which is where assigned right now may not be getting
5:12:56 the kind of district-wide exposure or support needed,
5:13:00 and could it be housed elsewhere?
5:13:03 Yes, but because of the fact that I have nowhere else
5:13:07 to put it, I would like to put the position
5:13:11 of the athletics director district-wide under Mr. Broome,
5:13:16 but reporting directly to me with regard to making sure
5:13:19 that I fully understand there are some issues
5:13:22 that have emerged that needed emergent attention.
5:13:27 I think some of you are shaking your head, you understand,
5:13:30 and that I need to know so that we can get this done,
5:13:34 and we can make an evaluation, that’s where it belongs,
5:13:37 or more importantly, in three or four months from now,
5:13:39 or whenever you get a new person to be the permanent,
5:13:43 that person can determine where she or he wants.
5:13:47 And the other thing is, and some of these things
5:13:50 have come out of our one-on-one situation,
5:13:54 the position of director of equity and diversity.
5:13:59 And I’m not talking about person,
5:14:01 I’m talking about position.
5:14:03 You know, that’s a very important district-wide coordination.
5:14:07 There are some questions that some people have raised
5:14:09 as to what have been deliverables, what is that role,
5:14:14 is it really working with staffing, or is it an ombudsman,
5:14:17 or is it this, that, well, it’s a lot of things.
5:14:22 But what came up in some of our conversations,
5:14:25 and I’ve also spoken with an individual there,
5:14:29 that there’s, at one time three years ago,
5:14:31 and I may be off on this,
5:14:32 there was an assistant superintendent
5:14:34 that was a cabinet-level position for choice and,
5:14:40 what, diversity?
5:14:41 - Equity. - Equity.
5:14:43 Three years ago, I believe the decision was made to,
5:14:46 and that person vacated the position,
5:14:49 to change that to a director.
5:14:53 And placed within another division.
5:14:58 Well, I’m trying to kind of maybe streamline that
5:15:00 a little bit, provide the support,
5:15:04 the administrative or secretarial, and also budget support.
5:15:09 And because of Dr. Cody’s expertise with that,
5:15:14 that seemed like, and she was very happy to have that
5:15:17 as a part of her responsibility as a staff member,
5:15:20 not as a direct report like an assistant superintendent,
5:15:23 so that it has district-wide areas,
5:15:25 because, as we’ve all pointed,
5:15:28 that some of the achievement gaps and dropout gaps
5:15:32 and graduation gaps exist among our subgroups,
5:15:37 meaning that some of our students are not progressing
5:15:41 as rapidly and successfully.
5:15:44 Well, it seemed to me that’s a very natural place.
5:15:46 Could it also report to the chief of staff?
5:15:48 Of course.
5:15:50 Problem is is that it’s a matter of workload management.
5:15:54 And since Dr. Cody has a particular long-standing,
5:15:57 and Dr. Vogel fortunately identified Dr. Cody for me,
5:16:02 I mean, he took a big load off my chip,
5:16:05 and I would say thank you, thank you very much, Dr. Cody,
5:16:09 I’m sorry, thank you very much, Dr. Vogel,
5:16:11 for the voluntary work that you’ve done
5:16:14 as part of your superintendent search,
5:16:17 and it was pro bono, folks, identifying people.
5:16:21 He’s also identified some outstanding people
5:16:24 that I would like to, with the board’s permission
5:16:28 down the road, like to revisit.
5:16:31 I’ve talked to these folks who are real specialists
5:16:34 in special ed, as a support services,
5:16:37 but due to the nature of it being interim,
5:16:40 I will tell you, our cabinet-level positions,
5:16:43 and even, there is no scaffolding.
5:16:47 There are people who are holding,
5:16:49 everyone should be worth a lot more
5:16:51 and get a lot more money, it hasn’t been done.
5:16:54 I really want, before I leave, to bring to you
5:16:57 ways in which you can become market competitive for Florida,
5:17:01 so that you can attract the very best when there’s a vacancy.
5:17:05 But there’s, in your, when I do,
5:17:07 when we do our salary analysis,
5:17:08 Dr. Green has been working overtime,
5:17:10 helping me go through the data.
5:17:12 I do these salary studies.
5:17:14 There’s no differentiation.
5:17:16 There are people, let’s just say, I’m not picking on one,
5:17:19 holding positions of principle,
5:17:22 that are making a higher salary
5:17:26 than people who are cabinet-level professionals.
5:17:29 There’s not, where’s the incentive
5:17:31 for someone who’s a principal, for example, to move up?
5:17:34 It’s not there.
5:17:35 So we need to revisit the good folks that are out there,
5:17:38 the positions that they hold.
5:17:40 You’ll decide on the people.
5:17:43 If we are to replace, I’m just gonna pick someone out,
5:17:46 like the CITO, or find someone to replace someone else
5:17:51 because they retire, and that’s what’s happening.
5:17:55 You’re not in a position to attract someone.
5:17:57 But as Dr. Vogel had pointed out, and I pointed out,
5:18:00 you may want to revisit the fact that in critical areas,
5:18:03 such as finding someone to head up
5:18:06 all of the special support services,
5:18:09 that it not be interim-based.
5:18:12 An outstanding candidate that was, again,
5:18:14 identified with Dr. Vogel,
5:18:15 could not pursue a further conversation with me
5:18:18 that we held because he couldn’t leave the position
5:18:21 that he is in now for a four-month position.
5:18:27 But if indeed it was the Board deemed
5:18:29 that we ought to be trying to find
5:18:31 the very best person outside,
5:18:33 we don’t have an individual inside today job ready.
5:18:38 Well, maybe that person could come here
5:18:40 by the time that I’m about ready to leave,
5:18:43 a new person come in, and that’s one less thing
5:18:45 that the permanent superintendent will have to look for.
5:18:49 Trying to find someone, and Dr. Vogel, I think,
5:18:53 told us this at the retreat, and I echo it.
5:18:56 In this market around the country,
5:18:59 if people are not place-bound to their home,
5:19:02 they can go and make huge amount of difference.
5:19:06 There are few candidates in several areas,
5:19:10 particularly special ed, who are looking to move,
5:19:15 or available to move, and they’re gonna move
5:19:17 to a situation where in this economy,
5:19:22 paying 275, 300,000 for certain positions,
5:19:26 here is a wonderful place to work, the conditions.
5:19:29 If I was years younger, I would love to be here.
5:19:32 What a place to be for the future in your district.
5:19:35 It’s in good order, and getting better every day.
5:19:39 The point being is that it should be
5:19:41 an enviable place to come for people,
5:19:43 but we need to make the conditions right.
5:19:45 So I will close by saying that I’ve tried to bring to you
5:19:49 my best thinking of what’s gonna work
5:19:51 for the next three to four months,
5:19:52 take some load off some people.
5:19:54 Two of our people, well, it would have been three
5:19:57 if Stephanie would have had the burden
5:20:00 of taking on support services along with the secondary,
5:20:03 Dr. Sullivan, I’m sorry.
5:20:05 But fortunately, we have outstanding people
5:20:08 of a blend of inside and out,
5:20:10 and some of these other tweaks gives to me
5:20:12 what I need to go forward, and that’s my recommendation
5:20:15 for your concurrence.
5:20:17 I also worked out for you, through Dr. Green and others,
5:20:23 the question of total savings and costs.
5:20:26 We’ve got vacant positions,
5:20:28 and you have that included in front of you.
5:20:30 So we can well afford, and I would like to be on record,
5:20:33 if they ask the board if I can come to you
5:20:35 in the next month or so in order for us to reposition
5:20:39 the salaries of your top-level folks
5:20:41 to make it market competitive,
5:20:44 and also to recognize that we’ve got great disparities
5:20:47 between and among levels of staff here.
5:20:50 I’d like to present that to you, and what you decide to do,
5:20:53 I’ll make my recommendation,
5:20:54 but the board can then determine.
5:20:56 We owe it to everybody that we try to do this.
5:20:59 What your ultimate decision is is that of the board.
5:21:02 It would not be responsible for me not to try to do something
5:21:06 in order to make things improve for not only today,
5:21:10 but your permanent superintendent,
5:21:12 who’s someday going to have to.
5:21:14 I mean, when you have people who have been here,
5:21:17 devoted and dedicated to this school district
5:21:20 in their jobs for the length they are,
5:21:22 number of them are knocking on the door
5:21:24 of drop in retirement.
5:21:26 Or are so talented that if they’re not gonna be placed down,
5:21:31 they could go elsewhere, and we don’t right now
5:21:34 have the kind of successor planning program or readiness
5:21:40 that I think this district can put together
5:21:44 in the bandwidth.
5:21:45 So, ladies and gentlemen, that’s the overall.
5:21:47 You’ve got all of the resumes and all of the matters
5:21:52 that I would ask that you provide concurrence.
5:21:56 Dr. Cody is set tomorrow, and Dr. Webley is set
5:21:59 on the 30th, which is Monday.
5:22:01 - Okay, thank you very much.
5:22:04 I don’t know if you guys are noticing the time.
5:22:05 It’s 2.14.
5:22:06 We have a renaming.
5:22:08 We have Vieira High Middle School.
5:22:09 We have a policy.
5:22:10 We have a couple of things.
5:22:12 So, if we can keep our conversations down
5:22:14 to about three minutes, make our points, and move.
5:22:16 If you guys, that’d be good so that we can get started.
5:22:18 Ms. Jenkins, you can go first.
5:22:23 - Yeah, I definitely am not gonna be rushed through this
5:22:25 ‘cause this is an important conversation,
5:22:27 and it’s on the agenda tonight.
5:22:28 So, we need to talk about this.
5:22:33 There’s some things that I agree with,
5:22:34 and there’s a lot of things that I don’t.
5:22:37 So, I completely understand the need to fill the HR position
5:22:40 as well as our student services position.
5:22:44 I have a lot of questions because what I’m hearing
5:22:48 is these changes are on an interim basis.
5:22:54 You know, they’re not permanent, right?
5:22:56 But I don’t understand the need for that concept
5:23:01 because I haven’t heard an identified purpose
5:23:05 as to why leaving it the way it is right now
5:23:07 has negative impacts until we get it permanent in place.
5:23:11 We have no guarantee of how that permanent superintendent
5:23:16 would, their leadership style,
5:23:19 the way in which they would like to reorganize.
5:23:22 And so, to me, I don’t understand why we would take
5:23:25 an already fragile and unstable cabinet
5:23:30 and leadership position and shake it all up
5:23:34 just for it to be potentially shook all up again
5:23:37 in six months.
5:23:39 That doesn’t make any sense to me.
5:23:40 And this is just my personal philosophy.
5:23:43 I believed that we hired an interim superintendent
5:23:46 to keep us afloat until we got to our permanent.
5:23:49 And actually, I’ll give credit to Mr. Trent.
5:23:51 When we were making this hire, I mean, he said,
5:23:55 I don’t think we have these huge significant changes
5:23:57 that we need to do in this interim.
5:23:59 We just need to keep ourselves afloat, and I agree.
5:24:05 I see our cost savings sheet here,
5:24:08 but it’s a little interesting to me
5:24:10 because I don’t look at it the same way.
5:24:13 Some of these positions are positions we already had vacant.
5:24:16 These are savings we’ve already acknowledged and absorbed
5:24:21 potentially to, I would have to ask Cindy here,
5:24:25 but I feel like we’ve already acknowledged these savings
5:24:28 previously when we’re talking about raises for people.
5:24:32 My biggest concern is the cost here.
5:24:35 It’s been two months since we’ve paid
5:24:39 almost a quarter million dollars to fire
5:24:41 an excellent superintendent, almost a quarter million dollars
5:24:43 to hire an interim superintendent.
5:24:45 $50,000 to hire a search team
5:24:47 to look for a permanent superintendent.
5:24:51 The new position that’s presented here
5:24:54 for an interim deputy superintendent is $150,000.
5:24:57 I think it’s not that piece of paper isn’t here.
5:25:01 I brought my concerns up to all of you
5:25:03 at the offsite meeting about other contracts going out
5:25:07 for contractors and audits for $30,000.
5:25:13 Yes, that one was canceled,
5:25:14 but one would assume we’re gonna do that one again,
5:25:17 which we’ll have questions about.
5:25:21 So my gut is we’re looking at almost
5:25:24 three quarters of a million dollars since November 22nd.
5:25:28 That concerns me.
5:25:30 Do I believe that people need raises?
5:25:32 Absolutely, I hear you on that.
5:25:35 Do they need market ready salaries
5:25:37 for us to tempt people to come fill
5:25:39 that HR position permanently
5:25:41 and our student services permanently?
5:25:43 100%, I hear you on that.
5:25:46 To me, that makes more sense as a priority
5:25:48 than shaking things up and moving this organization around.
5:25:52 The other thing that I don’t necessarily disagree
5:26:00 about hearing the need of a deputy superintendent,
5:26:03 but at the same time,
5:26:05 I’ve been here for two years without one.
5:26:07 And so it’s hard for me to justify,
5:26:10 at least at a minimum, doing that during an interim process.
5:26:13 I think we should find our permanent
5:26:15 and allow that person to decide
5:26:17 the organizational structure that works best for them.
5:26:20 And then one of my major concerns is the structure itself.
5:26:26 So our three departments that work closest with students,
5:26:32 the reason we’re all here and academic
5:26:36 are now removed from the direct ear of our superintendent.
5:26:40 And I don’t like that.
5:26:42 That feels yucky to me.
5:26:43 It looks yucky to me and it doesn’t make any sense
5:26:46 why those leaders in this organization
5:26:49 have now technically been further removed from the top.
5:26:55 That doesn’t make any sense to me at all.
5:27:03 Again, I’m very confused by the savings page.
5:27:06 I think it’s a little deceiving (laughs)
5:27:09 because like I said, I would love to sit down on paper
5:27:12 and calculate how much money we spent since November 22nd.
5:27:16 But it’s a lot, it’s a lot of money
5:27:18 and I think we’re making a lot of changes.
5:27:20 Again, I’m not gonna hash out my concerns
5:27:22 that I brought up to you all on December,
5:27:24 I don’t know, the 8th or 9th.
5:27:27 But I have concerns.
5:27:29 I have concerns about how quickly we’re spending money
5:27:32 to do more of a consultant job
5:27:36 versus the role of an interim superintendent.
5:27:39 It concerns me.
5:27:41 And so that’s what I feel like we’re doing here
5:27:44 and I don’t see the why.
5:27:47 For that $30,000 consultant,
5:27:48 I had asked very specific questions
5:27:50 as to what specific reasons did we have to do this, why?
5:27:55 What was the why behind it?
5:27:56 Give me specific examples of why
5:27:58 and I haven’t gotten that answer yet.
5:28:00 And I’m feeling the same about this.
5:28:02 I feel like this is super rushed
5:28:03 without a really clear explanation of the negatives.
5:28:07 If we don’t do it, here’s the negatives.
5:28:10 Not only do I think our staff deserve to hear that,
5:28:13 but I think the community deserves to hear that
5:28:15 when we’re looking of spending even more taxpayer money
5:28:18 so very, very, very, very quickly.
5:28:23 - Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
5:28:23 Ms. Campbell?
5:28:26 - I’ll just keep my short, mine short.
5:28:27 I support the recommendations for the reorganization.
5:28:31 I would just say you actually haven’t served
5:28:34 on the board without a deputy.
5:28:35 Maybe not this kind of deputy, but–
5:28:37 - No, not a separate deputy.
5:28:39 - We’ve already always had a deputy.
5:28:42 And that was tied to the person, not necessarily to the role
5:28:44 because when Dr. Thede moved from COO to HR,
5:28:47 the deputy position moved with her.
5:28:50 I think this will be good for the interim all.
5:28:53 Again, just emphasize interim.
5:28:55 The new positions are interim.
5:28:57 That new position is interim, the way I appreciate
5:29:01 that you’ve been able to find people
5:29:03 to fill on interim basis
5:29:04 ‘cause I recognize that it’s a challenge.
5:29:05 So I support the plan as described.
5:29:10 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
5:29:11 Mr. Trent?
5:29:14 - All right, well, this is surely a family agreement
5:29:19 with everyone and disagreement with everyone.
5:29:22 But there’ll be areas where I feel strongly on this board
5:29:26 because of my experience, and I’ll dig in there.
5:29:28 This isn’t one of them.
5:29:31 Dr. Schiller’s here because of his experience.
5:29:34 And I’m gonna leave it to him for this time.
5:29:39 You can do anything for a period of time.
5:29:41 And both Mr. Susan and Ms. Campbell,
5:29:45 you’ve had the luxury of having
5:29:47 that interim deputy superintendent.
5:29:48 And with your agreeing on that,
5:29:51 it would be nothing but personal if I would be against that
5:29:55 because I’m gonna defer and say if that’s the recommendation
5:30:00 and he’s here for his experience,
5:30:02 I’m going to let him put forth his experience.
5:30:07 - Thank you, Mr. Trent.
5:30:08 Ms. Wright?
5:30:11 - I’m going to echo your sentiments.
5:30:13 I trust your guidance, Dr. Schiller, and your expertise.
5:30:17 I believe that there is a purpose behind this.
5:30:20 None of this is just being thrown out there
5:30:22 for no reason whatsoever.
5:30:24 And I think it will strategically place
5:30:25 our district in a stronger position
5:30:26 and help our leadership team.
5:30:28 So I will support this restructuring as well.
5:30:33 - And Mr. Schiller, I echo the comments
5:30:35 of all of my fellow board members
5:30:36 in positive support of your plan.
5:30:39 I think moving forward, you had some tough positions to fill
5:30:42 that we had in a quick vacancy.
5:30:43 And I look forward to seeing what this new team can do
5:30:46 under your new structure.
5:30:47 So I appreciate it.
5:30:48 Thank you very much.
5:30:49 - Thank you, board members.
5:30:51 Would you want me to respond on point two?
5:30:53 - No, we’re good to go.
5:30:54 If we got majority, we’re good to go.
5:30:56 - Just keep in mind that these are,
5:30:59 the proration over four months is a little bit different,
5:31:02 which we tried to show you the full year.
5:31:05 - Yup, I agree.
5:31:05 - And that I think is important.
5:31:07 Number two, there were two vacancies.
5:31:11 - Yeah, Dr. Schiller, thank you so much.
5:31:14 I think now we are,
5:31:15 and I appreciate that one going pretty good.
5:31:19 The next one that we have is facilities named
5:31:22 Edgewood Junior Senior High School.
5:31:24 If I can say that.
5:31:26 Next, Dr. Sullivan,
5:31:28 Assistant Superintendent of Secondary Leading and Learning
5:31:31 will provide an update on facility naming
5:31:32 for Edgewood Junior Senior and Stone Middle School.
5:31:36 Thank you so much, Dr. Sullivan,
5:31:38 for coming quickly to the board.
5:31:49 - Thank you, Mr. Susan, board members, and Dr. Schiller.
5:31:52 These are actually the, Dr. Sullivan, your mics.
5:31:55 - Yeah, hang on, I’m gonna try to figure this one out.
5:31:57 Go, hang on, there you go, go.
5:31:59 No, try it, try it now.
5:32:01 Some reason it said here.
5:32:02 - Thank you, oh, thank you.
5:32:02 Thank you, Mr. Susan, board members, Dr. Schiller.
5:32:06 These are the first requests under our revised policy
5:32:10 in regards to naming of school facilities.
5:32:13 And that policy required before a school
5:32:19 completed the renaming process
5:32:22 or even engaged the community
5:32:24 to receive a board approval to move forward.
5:32:28 And so both Stone Magnet Middle School
5:32:32 and Edgewood Junior Senior High
5:32:34 are requesting to engage in the process
5:32:36 based on their advisory council approval
5:32:40 to name specific parts of their campuses.
5:32:42 In the case of Edgewood Junior Senior,
5:32:45 it’s related to a stage in a classroom.
5:32:50 And for Stone Magnet Middle School for their gym.
5:32:53 And so they reached that preliminary threshold,
5:32:56 which meant the next step was board approval.
5:32:59 It will be on the agenda,
5:33:01 the next board agenda for approval,
5:33:04 but wanted to present it for an opportunity
5:33:05 for any questions or inquiries from the board.
5:33:09 - Thank you, Dr. Sullivan.
5:33:10 I’ll start off with Ms. Jenkins.
5:33:11 Ms. Jenkins, do you have any questions,
5:33:12 comments or concerns?
5:33:16 Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
5:33:20 Mr. Trent.
5:33:24 - I don’t have any ideas.
5:33:25 - And Ms. Wright, it sounds like this is good.
5:33:27 You got, you’re successful through.
5:33:28 Thank you for the new naming policy.
5:33:30 Thank you for the first successful one, right?
5:33:32 - Well, we’re not there yet.
5:33:34 So we’ll be on–
5:33:36 - I know, I know, I know, but it’s moving.
5:33:38 - It’s moving along, thank you.
5:33:40 - All right, all righty, perfect.
5:33:44 Hang on, we’re moving so fast, I can’t even,
5:33:46 I can’t even get to my script in time.
5:33:48 - I just have to say, now we get to the,
5:33:50 my favorite PowerPoint that we ever have
5:33:53 come from facilities.
5:33:54 I know, sorry everybody else, but I do have a favorite.
5:33:56 Sue is my favorite PowerPoint creator.
5:33:58 - All right, well, it’s usually
5:34:00 ‘cause she has animals in there.
5:34:01 So next, Ms. Hand, Assistant Superintendent of Facilities
5:34:04 will provide an update to the new
5:34:05 Middle School Attendance Boundary Change Process.
5:34:08 - Good afternoon, everybody.
5:34:10 I’m gonna go through this rather quickly
5:34:12 and frame it in the sense that tonight or today,
5:34:15 I’m talking more about process than product,
5:34:18 but I wanted to give you something,
5:34:20 sort of a starting point.
5:34:21 So we’re at the very beginning of discussion
5:34:24 regarding the middle school boundaries
5:34:26 for the new middle school in the era,
5:34:30 and just wanted to kind of go through
5:34:32 some of our initial thoughts at a staff level.
5:34:35 We start this with a boundary change team
5:34:37 and we bring in the academic side of the house,
5:34:38 facilities, our transportation folks,
5:34:41 and we kind of chat about different aspects
5:34:44 of considerations that are under discussion
5:34:48 relative to boundaries, and those include things
5:34:51 like enrollment and transportation
5:34:53 and different programs and the community.
5:34:56 And so we have to, for lack of a better word,
5:35:00 develop a straw man, and that’s what you’ll see today.
5:35:04 And then the process really next goes out into the community
5:35:08 and we get community feedback,
5:35:10 we meet again at a staff level,
5:35:12 and then we bring this back to the board
5:35:14 in three different sessions, including a board workshop
5:35:17 where we may make some additional changes and modifications
5:35:20 from what will ultimately be a staff recommendation.
5:35:23 And then there will be an action agenda item
5:35:28 to schedule a public hearing,
5:35:30 and then there will be a public hearing
5:35:31 before these go into effect.
5:35:33 So we’re at the very beginning of this process today,
5:35:36 but since we have an approval to proceed
5:35:38 with the middle school, we felt like
5:35:39 now was the time to really get rolling.
5:35:43 Also bringing this to you today,
5:35:44 because we want to engage the public
5:35:47 while the school year is still in effect,
5:35:48 so I don’t wanna do this process during the summer,
5:35:51 didn’t wanna start the process during the winter break,
5:35:53 so I think we’ve got a good opportunity here
5:35:55 over the next few months to really engage the families
5:35:58 that are in the Viera area.
5:36:00 So as I’m sure you’ve noticed, the Viera area is growing,
5:36:04 and there’s some slides in the presentation
5:36:06 that show some of the projections for families and students
5:36:10 in the Viera area, and it’s pretty significant.
5:36:12 And so we are considering what’s happening
5:36:17 in terms of the growth in the Viera area
5:36:20 as we look at the boundaries for the middle school.
5:36:23 So we want to serve existing students,
5:36:25 but also make sure that we’re leaving some capacity
5:36:28 and capability to serve students that will come to us
5:36:32 from within the Viera community.
5:36:34 But really, this is one of those situations
5:36:36 where there’s almost unlimited permutations and combinations,
5:36:39 so there’s a lot of different ways that we could do this,
5:36:41 and so we worked at it on a staff level,
5:36:44 and what we have today is just something
5:36:46 for you to look at.
5:36:48 In terms of timing, we are recommending
5:36:51 a hard boundary implementation for the first year
5:36:53 in August of ‘24 when the school opens.
5:36:56 And then we’ll be working with the transportation team
5:36:59 as to any special considerations that we will provide
5:37:02 for transportation in those first couple years.
5:37:05 I think with the middle school,
5:37:06 we won’t really know until it happens,
5:37:09 but students who are in sixth grade now
5:37:12 that will be in eighth grade when the school opens,
5:37:14 whether they will move to the school or not,
5:37:16 and whether they will want to stay in their current school.
5:37:19 So I think that conversation will happen
5:37:21 as we get community engagement
5:37:22 and understand what the community’s needs are
5:37:25 through our community engagement process.
5:37:27 Let me just run through this real quickly for you.
5:37:30 This shows you the middle school site.
5:37:32 It’s a little under 30 acres,
5:37:33 just north of Viera High School.
5:37:35 That site will be under construction later this year.
5:37:39 Next week, next week.
5:37:41 So we’ll be starting with our groundbreaking next week.
5:37:45 This is the Viera Master Plan.
5:37:48 And it’s overlaid, you can see on the aerial.
5:37:50 This is a little bit dated,
5:37:52 but basically Village Center and Village One,
5:37:54 those areas are pretty well developed.
5:37:57 That’s kind of what you see
5:37:58 as you drive through the Viera area now.
5:38:00 Village Two is under construction.
5:38:03 Those are a lot of residential units
5:38:05 kind of at the south end.
5:38:07 And then Village Three is to our west
5:38:09 and is completely undeveloped.
5:38:11 So we wanted to make sure that we were considering
5:38:13 what might happen in terms of development patterns
5:38:16 moving forward.
5:38:18 So a little bit more detail on the slides.
5:38:19 Village Two, estimating about 5,500 residential units.
5:38:24 Village Three to our west, another 4,000 residential units.
5:38:29 So the next series of maps shows you
5:38:33 what we’re calling a base boundary.
5:38:36 And from the staff’s perspective,
5:38:38 the base boundary will be the one,
5:38:40 this is the start.
5:38:42 And then potentially we may want to add in areas
5:38:46 primarily to the east, even the northeast
5:38:49 or the southeast of this red polygon.
5:38:52 So these series of slides show you
5:38:54 the boundaries overlaid with middle school boundaries
5:38:57 as they stand today.
5:39:00 And we’ll also show you some of the elementary
5:39:02 and high school overlays.
5:39:04 So the red polygon here is the base
5:39:07 and then you’ll see area one.
5:39:09 That is to the southeast.
5:39:11 And that will pick up primarily the Suntree/Baytree areas.
5:39:15 And then areas two and three,
5:39:18 those are areas coincident
5:39:20 with the Viera High School boundary.
5:39:23 Area one is basically the Suntree Elementary boundary.
5:39:26 So it affects like which feeder schools go where.
5:39:30 So that’s why the maps you’ll see coming up here
5:39:32 are overlaid with elementary and the high school boundaries.
5:39:36 This map shows you the overlay of the red polygon
5:39:40 and the potential add-on areas with the Viera master plan.
5:39:44 So we’re picking up most of what is in the Viera
5:39:48 ERI development of regional impact.
5:39:50 So what is formally considered the development
5:39:53 that is called Viera.
5:39:55 This is the overlay with the elementary school boundaries.
5:39:58 Again, shows you the base polygon as well as area one,
5:40:02 picking up all of Suntree as a feeder school
5:40:06 and areas two and three will pick up part of Williams
5:40:09 as feeder schools.
5:40:11 This chart shows you which elementary schools
5:40:14 feed into the new middle school.
5:40:17 This is the high school boundaries
5:40:19 and shows you for the most part picking up
5:40:23 Viera High School and then areas one, two and three
5:40:26 also are Viera High School students.
5:40:31 This chart kind of gives you a sense
5:40:33 of looking at the situation over time
5:40:36 and you’ll see this in the charts and the different options
5:40:39 where we’re looking at this when the school opens.
5:40:43 So today’s fifth and sixth grade students conceivably
5:40:46 will be seventh and eighth grade students in 2024.
5:40:50 So those are the numbers that we looked at.
5:40:52 There’s a lot of different ways to look at that
5:40:55 but this is where we started.
5:40:56 And then we looked at projected growth
5:40:59 within those polygons based on primarily the growth
5:41:04 in the Viera area but also where those polygons
5:41:07 touch outside of the Viera boundaries.
5:41:10 We do pick up either growth and in some cases decline
5:41:13 in enrollment or in student projections
5:41:15 that translates to enrollment projections
5:41:18 within a one to five year period
5:41:20 and a five to 10 year period.
5:41:22 This chart also shows you the existing
5:41:24 fifth and sixth grade students
5:41:25 that are currently in charter schools.
5:41:27 We don’t have a good sense of if any students
5:41:30 might move from charter schools
5:41:32 or how the market will react to BPS
5:41:36 having a middle school in this area
5:41:38 but there’s certainly a large number of students
5:41:40 that could consider coming to the middle school in Viera.
5:41:44 So that data is relevant to this conversation as well
5:41:48 when we move forward.
5:41:50 The chart also shows you the factored capacity
5:41:53 for each of the middle schools in the general area
5:41:56 and shows you the potential growth
5:41:58 generated by the Viera development
5:42:00 in particular for middle school students.
5:42:05 So these are some of the boundary,
5:42:08 this is the base map that shows you
5:42:09 the base boundary areas one, two and three
5:42:12 and then the next series of slides
5:42:13 to show you some of the different permutations
5:42:15 and combinations that we were looking at
5:42:18 and how those boundaries potentially
5:42:21 affect adjacent area schools.
5:42:23 And so area A is just the base area.
5:42:28 Area B is the base area plus area one.
5:42:33 Area C is the base area plus area two.
5:42:37 And option D shows the base area plus area one
5:42:41 plus area two.
5:42:43 Area E adds in two and three.
5:42:46 And area, I’m sorry, option F shows the base area
5:42:50 plus one, two and three.
5:42:52 So when we started looking at this at a staff level
5:42:55 we were up to option Q and decided
5:42:58 that maybe we could narrow it down a little bit.
5:43:01 But this kind of shows you the different permutations
5:43:04 and combinations that we consider
5:43:05 as we start talking to the community.
5:43:09 Option G was generated by our transportation folks.
5:43:13 They have some very specific requirements
5:43:16 about where they can cross the railroad
5:43:18 and those types of things that I can’t articulate
5:43:21 in any detail.
5:43:22 But they looked at it wholly from the perspective
5:43:25 of transportation and they put forth a boundary as well.
5:43:29 So I wanted to make sure that that was in the mix
5:43:31 as we go forward in our process.
5:43:34 So you can look through the various options
5:43:37 and if you have some comments
5:43:38 I’d like to be happy to entertain them.
5:43:40 But we’re in a place now where we’re just starting
5:43:42 the process and we wanna start talking with the community.
5:43:46 So the community engagement plan includes,
5:43:49 we will have a project specific website.
5:43:51 We’ll have a dedicated phone number, email address
5:43:54 that is kind of directed specifically to our staff
5:43:58 to address concerns and comments and questions
5:44:00 about the middle school.
5:44:01 We’ve also coordinated with our construction contractor
5:44:04 because we believe there’s gonna be some folks
5:44:07 that ask our construction contractor about boundaries
5:44:09 and that ask us about construction.
5:44:11 So we’re trying to make sure that we have a good solid way
5:44:15 to communicate to our constituents
5:44:17 about what’s happening with the middle school
5:44:19 both with construction and with the boundary process.
5:44:22 We envision having some stakeholder meetings.
5:44:25 We’re going to do some type of an online survey
5:44:28 where folks, and some of you may remember this,
5:44:32 during the pandemic we had the ability
5:44:34 to provide comments online
5:44:35 and you fill out basically a Google form
5:44:37 and then we compiled and we did that
5:44:39 with some of our prior boundary efforts.
5:44:42 So we wanna be able to reach people where they are.
5:44:45 So they may wanna come to a meeting,
5:44:47 they may wanna fill out an online survey,
5:44:48 but we wanna be able to get a good representation
5:44:52 of opinions about our boundary process.
5:44:56 So we’ll be standing those up very soon.
5:44:58 And then again, as I mentioned at the beginning,
5:45:01 our tentative schedule is community engagement
5:45:03 in February and March, the information agenda for the board,
5:45:07 April 11th, action agenda, April 25th,
5:45:10 and public hearing on May 30th.
5:45:13 So we should expect a board workshop
5:45:16 that follows up on all of the public engagement
5:45:18 and provides a recommendation to you sometime in late March.
5:45:23 - Thank you, Ms. Han.
5:45:24 I think many of you guys haven’t been through
5:45:27 a redistricting and all this other stuff.
5:45:30 And it’s a good, I will tell you having Ms. Suhan
5:45:33 as the shepherd is going to be pretty good.
5:45:36 I think some of the factors you’ll see just naturally come.
5:45:39 So I think we’re too early to really start deep diving
5:45:41 in conversations about things.
5:45:43 But I will be giving you guys contact information
5:45:46 to PTOs and everybody else if you wanna reach out to them.
5:45:48 They’ll be out there and doing stuff like that.
5:45:50 But I did wanna give everybody an opportunity real quick
5:45:53 to speak if they wanted to, as long as we can be cognizant
5:45:56 that we do have a few more things on the agenda.
5:45:58 So Ms. Jenkins, do you have anything to speak to on this?
5:46:02 - No, Ms. Han, you are exceptional
5:46:04 and a wonderful professional.
5:46:05 And I appreciate all of your presentations
5:46:07 because they’re always perfect for me to see.
5:46:09 So thank you very much.
5:46:11 - Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
5:46:12 Ms. Campbell.
5:46:13 - There was only one animal slide in it, well, two.
5:46:16 But it was an elephant, so I’ll forgive you.
5:46:19 I just wanna throw this out there
5:46:21 because I think we have to,
5:46:22 you know, it’s a good question for me to ask.
5:46:23 I appreciate over the last few years
5:46:25 that your division has taken a very conscientious approach
5:46:32 to make these changes, which can be very controversial
5:46:35 and cause a lot of angst in the community.
5:46:37 But I did wanna throw out there,
5:46:38 considering that we have some areas,
5:46:41 my area down south in particular,
5:46:43 where the schools are fuller and we don’t have a place,
5:46:46 we don’t have capacity if there’s a lot of growth.
5:46:49 And especially in the Palm Bay area,
5:46:50 we know there is potential for huge growth.
5:46:53 Was there ever, I mean, what is the,
5:46:56 what if we do fruit basket turnover
5:46:59 and redraw all the lines and, you know, I mean,
5:47:02 what is the, if I really wanna make the community mad?
5:47:06 - Listen, you’re getting into an area I love.
5:47:08 What is, you know, was that one of the A through Q plans?
5:47:15 - Right now Sue’s just–
5:47:16 - Let’s just turn it all upside down.
5:47:18 - So, I would encourage you to check in
5:47:25 with what’s going on in Hillsborough County,
5:47:27 ‘cause that is exactly what they were doing.
5:47:29 And we have a planning consultant
5:47:31 that we went through an RFQ process,
5:47:33 so we have a planning consultant available.
5:47:35 It is the same planning consultant
5:47:36 that’s working through that process in Hillsborough,
5:47:39 and they’re doing pretty much what you’ve suggested.
5:47:42 It’s a very controversial and painful exercise
5:47:46 for the community.
5:47:47 - Well, what’s another one?
5:47:48 - No, I would be scheduling my retirement soon.
5:47:51 (all laughing)
5:47:53 About that time.
5:47:55 But, in terms of Palm Bay, I do wanna say, you’re right,
5:47:59 and that is our next area of growth,
5:48:01 and you will probably see some recommendations
5:48:04 for a new elementary school in that area
5:48:07 coming up with a student accommodation plan.
5:48:09 We’re actively talking to major developers down there
5:48:13 to see if there are some school sites available,
5:48:15 and we think that’s next.
5:48:18 - Right, and don’t hear me recommending that,
5:48:20 but I have to throw it out there,
5:48:22 ‘cause we do have schools that are under capacity,
5:48:25 especially in the northern half of the county,
5:48:27 whereas in the south, we’re more full.
5:48:31 I know we have that in our plan, in a five to 10-year plan
5:48:35 for a new elementary in the south area,
5:48:36 but we don’t have a plan for a middle school,
5:48:38 and we do have the largest middle schools in the county
5:48:42 or in the south end, and they’re built that way.
5:48:45 They’re built to hold a lot.
5:48:46 They’re not using outbuildings and things like that,
5:48:47 but I don’t think the model of a 1200 student middle school,
5:48:53 I mean, it works for Central,
5:48:54 but it’s not necessarily always the best, so I didn’t know.
5:48:59 I am not recommending that, but hey,
5:49:01 I’m not running for re-election, so who cares?
5:49:03 (laughing)
5:49:05 But I just wanted to throw it out there.
5:49:08 Is that something?
5:49:09 But yes, I have seen the news articles about Hillsborough,
5:49:11 and certainly there’s a lot of angst,
5:49:13 so don’t anybody walk out of the room
5:49:15 thinking it can you stir in the pot?
5:49:17 I just had to ask. - No, no, no, listen.
5:49:18 I stirred it a couple years ago, so thank you, Ms. Campbell.
5:49:20 - I do believe that this exercise is going to lead us
5:49:23 to some of those conversations on a district-wide basis.
5:49:27 - Mr. Trenk, got anything, no?
5:49:29 - No. - Okay, Ms. Wright?
5:49:30 - Thank you very much for– - Ms. Wright?
5:49:32 - Yeah, thank you, Sue.
5:49:33 You are always amazing and on top of it,
5:49:35 so you are appreciated and very thorough, so we love you.
5:49:38 Don’t retire, thank you.
5:49:39 - Thank you, Ms. Sue.
5:49:40 I think you put together a great presentation.
5:49:42 I would entertain us using the restroom break
5:49:44 for five minutes if you guys needed that.
5:49:45 Is that okay?
5:49:46 I’m trying to follow my friend here.
5:49:49 She’s always getting on me ‘cause I’m not doing it.
5:49:51 - Can we recommend that we flip-flop,
5:49:53 since we have our guest for FSBA?
5:49:55 Can we go ahead and take them after the break?
5:49:57 - I would rather just get the policy done.
5:49:58 - And the policy done?
5:49:59 - Yeah, ‘cause that way we can get it done.
5:50:00 So I’m just gonna take a five-minute break,
5:50:02 and we’ll come right back.
5:50:03 (gavel banging)
5:50:03 Here we go.
5:50:13 (upbeat music)
5:50:27 (upbeat music continues)
5:59:52 (silence)
6:00:11 - Next is a work session on board policy 2521
6:00:16 instructional materials program.
6:00:18 Ms. Klein, assistant superintendent
6:00:19 of elementary leading and learning
6:00:20 will explain the changes made followed by board discussion.
6:00:24 Ms. Klein.
6:00:25 - Thank you, Mr. Sussan and board.
6:00:28 As discussed previously,
6:00:30 the reflection on looking back at 2521,
6:00:34 specifically section T,
6:00:37 the process for requesting reconsideration
6:00:40 of non-state adopted instruction materials,
6:00:45 classroom and library.
6:00:47 These proposed revisions do not encompass the suggestion,
6:00:51 suggested language from the NEOLA.
6:00:54 However, they’re best served our district.
6:00:57 So we will proceed through what changes Dr. Sullivan
6:01:02 and I made to section T
6:01:05 and know that today is the, I’m sorry,
6:01:11 next board meeting on the seventh,
6:01:13 we will have a rural development at workshop
6:01:16 and then public hearing on that afternoon
6:01:19 and for information and approval,
6:01:21 if there’s no suggestions today on 221.
6:01:25 So with that, I will entertain any concerns from the board
6:01:30 on section T of 2521.
6:01:35 We took out a lot of material.
6:01:38 - Is everybody wanting to speak?
6:01:39 So should I put an order together or are we good?
6:01:42 You’re wanting to speak Ms. Jenkins?
6:01:44 - No, but you don’t need to be hard.
6:01:45 - All right, Ms. Campbell.
6:01:47 - No, I think this is, you did a good job
6:01:50 of putting in what we asked for
6:01:53 and it took me a while to follow through
6:01:55 because of all the cross-outs.
6:01:56 - There is a lot, there is a lot.
6:01:57 - Oh wait, there it is.
6:01:59 But it was a lot to cover and I appreciate it.
6:02:00 The only question I had was with the new release
6:02:04 of the state board trainings,
6:02:09 I don’t necessarily think that applies
6:02:10 to our review process, but is there something up
6:02:13 in the earlier part of the policies
6:02:14 that we’re gonna have to change regarding that?
6:02:18 - The training, I don’t believe so,
6:02:21 but we’ll have to take another look at that.
6:02:23 I did not look at other portions.
6:02:25 That training is occurring as we speak.
6:02:28 - Right.
6:02:29 - And I actually took it myself just so I understood it.
6:02:34 And so it went out to all media specialists
6:02:37 and they’re in the process of taking that training
6:02:40 and they were doing Q and A’s with media specialists
6:02:43 as it may be.
6:02:45 - Yes.
6:02:46 - Thank you, Ms. Campbell.
6:02:47 - Oh, I’m sorry.
6:02:48 - No, no, no.
6:02:48 - To add to, it’s a two for one today.
6:02:51 The new training and the state board rules call
6:02:54 for a district to have a policy
6:02:56 that allows for the objection.
6:02:59 We’ve actually had policy preceding
6:03:01 the new state board rules.
6:03:03 And so as always, we’ll review
6:03:05 the NEOLA language recommendations,
6:03:08 but there’s not new material for policy.
6:03:12 It’s the procedural aspect.
6:03:14 - Gotcha, thank you.
6:03:15 - Thank you.
6:03:17 Mr. Trent.
6:03:22 - All right, so unless I’m missing it or if it’s here,
6:03:25 so are we at a point where, I mean,
6:03:29 in here does it say when we’re asking
6:03:32 for material to be reviewed, say in the libraries,
6:03:35 is it being removed and then reviewed
6:03:38 and then put back in?
6:03:40 - Yes.
6:03:40 - I thought I saw it.
6:03:41 - As the recommendation, yes.
6:03:43 - Perfect.
6:03:45 I appreciate it, thank you.
6:03:48 - I don’t have anything, good job, ladies, thank you.
6:03:50 - Thank you.
6:03:50 - Hang on, Dr. Shiller, hang on.
6:03:52 - Anything else?
6:03:53 - Yeah, I just wanna say thank you so much
6:03:54 for putting this together.
6:03:55 It was a lot of work, I really appreciate that.
6:03:57 And I think we’ve got a pretty good plan.
6:04:00 The one thing that we may wanna do
6:04:02 is start talking about, the one thing that was outlining
6:04:05 that I think we may wanna do is, as we had said,
6:04:07 in the event to move some of these faster,
6:04:09 we would like to try to give you guys
6:04:10 some more representatives so that we can form
6:04:12 a couple more committees so that we can get these things
6:04:14 knocked out and get ‘em back on or get ‘em off the shelf.
6:04:18 When would you like us to start trying that?
6:04:20 Do you need board direction?
6:04:21 What do we need to do there?
6:04:23 - Well, that’s an interesting question
6:04:25 because of this today’s moment in time.
6:04:29 And so we did change the policy to reflect
6:04:32 that the board can direct for additional committees
6:04:35 and that’s not problematic.
6:04:37 - I saw that, yep.
6:04:38 - As of today, we do not have any pending formal reviews.
6:04:43 I anticipate that changing in the very near future,
6:04:46 but that’s just my best guess
6:04:50 off just some informed information.
6:04:53 So as of right now, as of today,
6:04:55 there’s no pending formals.
6:04:57 And so we will certainly, I will certainly
6:05:00 keep the board informed through Dr. Schiller
6:05:03 when we receive formals, what that looks like,
6:05:06 and then you all can continue to discuss it
6:05:09 at your meetings and let us know when you’d like us
6:05:12 through Dr. Schiller to convene in other meetings.
6:05:15 It’s not problematic at all.
6:05:17 - Yes, ma’am, go ahead.
6:05:18 - So did the person who had put in the request before
6:05:21 withdraw their request?
6:05:24 - Yes, received communication from the petitioner
6:05:29 for the remaining nine.
6:05:31 She had indicated to rescind them
6:05:34 for a variety of different reasons,
6:05:39 but we definitely anticipate a continuation
6:05:41 of receiving formal ones and prepared, of course,
6:05:45 to engage in that process as soon as we do
6:05:47 and in particular, after the board finishes
6:05:51 the rule-making process.
6:05:53 - So either way, if we haven’t already,
6:05:55 we need to go ahead and have our representatives
6:05:57 ready for February 21st, at least when the policy
6:06:01 is assuming that it goes along,
6:06:02 that we vote on on the 21st, we need to have those names
6:06:05 of the board representatives,
6:06:07 at least for the first committee.
6:06:08 - So for the three previous board members,
6:06:14 I have your recommendation.
6:06:16 They know we’re on a hold right now
6:06:18 and then we’ll certainly codify that information.
6:06:22 I believe I’ve received Mrs. Wright’s
6:06:24 and we’ll send, we’ll catch the new members up
6:06:28 to the same policies and guidelines
6:06:30 that we sent out for them.
6:06:32 - All right, thank you very much.
6:06:35 I think we’ve got everybody and we needed to.
6:06:37 Thank you so much for your time.
6:06:38 I really appreciate it.
6:06:39 Next, FSB is present to review
6:06:41 the superintendent search timeline and online survey.
6:06:44 Mr. FSB 18, come on down.
6:06:49 I know Mr. Vogel.
6:06:50 I know, I got a cell phone.
6:06:52 No, I know, I just, I saw him moving
6:06:54 and I was like, I’m just gonna call him FSB A guys.
6:06:57 Thank you.
6:07:03 (faintly speaking)
6:07:08 - Thank you, Mr. Chair, and good afternoon, everyone.
6:07:11 In our last meeting, I had more or less
6:07:13 two homework assignments to do.
6:07:16 One was to come back and present the board
6:07:19 with a draft timeline, search timeline
6:07:23 that we would follow as we proceed forward
6:07:25 in searching for your next superintendent
6:07:27 and also to provide some draft survey information
6:07:31 to have you take a look at
6:07:33 and more or less receive your input on that.
6:07:37 So if I can immediately just move to the business at hand.
6:07:41 First, the search timeline.
6:07:45 It is fairly self-explanatory, I hope,
6:07:47 with the dates and the issues that are reflected there.
6:07:52 I did wanna ask on the January 30th through February 17th
6:07:56 the time that we’ll have our survey up and running
6:07:59 for public input and also the time to conduct
6:08:02 the community forums and also your focus groups
6:08:06 on your three employee groups and also your student group.
6:08:10 I wanted to confirm the number of community forums
6:08:14 that you would request.
6:08:16 I wasn’t sure if it was three or four from my notes.
6:08:20 I had a couple of scratch outs there, so.
6:08:23 - Did we say three, ‘cause we wanted north, central, and south?
6:08:26 - Yeah, but we had talked about the idea of doing one
6:08:28 on the beach side. - That’s right.
6:08:30 - Look, that’s up to you, the two up here.
6:08:33 You guys represent beaches.
6:08:35 Both you and Ms. Jenkins represent the beaches.
6:08:37 I just wanted the availability.
6:08:39 It’s up to you guys.
6:08:41 It’s a definite culture, beach side,
6:08:43 so I’m okay with it if you guys wanna do it,
6:08:44 but wanted to just check in with you guys.
6:08:47 - I think it would be a really good move,
6:08:49 ‘cause some of the town halls that were hosted,
6:08:51 there was a pretty large attendance at the satellite theater
6:08:55 and this was like, wasn’t like too many hot topics
6:09:00 going on at the time,
6:09:01 and there still was a really large attendance there,
6:09:03 so this would be a hot topic.
6:09:04 And so I think it would pull a lot of people,
6:09:07 and yeah, as crazy as it sounds,
6:09:09 people don’t cross the bridge.
6:09:10 And so if we wanna have many people participate as possible,
6:09:13 I think it would be smart for us to get it beach side.
6:09:15 - Sounds good, Mr. Trent.
6:09:16 - Yeah, somewhere on beach side would be.
6:09:18 - But then we have to duke it out Merritt Island
6:09:20 or satellite, so.
6:09:21 - Well, I think beach side, satellite,
6:09:23 Cocoa Beach, Cape Canaveral.
6:09:24 - Like A1A beach side, yeah.
6:09:26 - Yeah, I think, and if they can make recommendations
6:09:30 and you guys just figure it out.
6:09:31 - Okay, four.
6:09:33 - Mr. Chair, if I could ask, so we’ll have four.
6:09:37 Who would I contact to identify those four schools
6:09:40 and work for a date?
6:09:42 We typically would have our community forums at six.
6:09:46 The public seems to respond well to six o’clock forums,
6:09:50 get off work, take care of family matters,
6:09:52 and then come out or even grab.
6:09:53 - Russell Bruhn will be your contact for that.
6:09:56 - Okay, perfect.
6:09:57 - Yes, sir.
6:09:57 - We’ll get with him and schedule those
6:09:58 and get those on the calendar.
6:10:00 When I modify the calendar, I’ll send it back to Tammy
6:10:04 with the date specifically there.
6:10:06 ‘Cause we would like, once the board kind of gives us
6:10:08 consensus on this timeline search,
6:10:11 is to post it to your website
6:10:12 so your public knows what’s going on as well.
6:10:16 So moving through, I did put in the,
6:10:18 acknowledge the time for spring break.
6:10:21 I worked with Tammy on some of your board work session dates.
6:10:26 I did have to put in two special meetings,
6:10:29 ‘cause I know the board wanted to try to get
6:10:32 all of the search completed prior to your graduations.
6:10:36 I think your graduations are the 22nd through the 27th.
6:10:40 So this timeframe gets us through the process
6:10:45 to where you actually conduct your onsite interviews
6:10:49 of your finalists on April the 27th and 28th.
6:10:53 And May the 2nd would be a special board meeting
6:10:57 to select your new superintendent.
6:11:00 - So do you want discussion on that timeline real quick?
6:11:03 Is that what you would like?
6:11:04 - Yes, sir, if there’s any input there
6:11:05 and kind of get consensus that we can move forward with this
6:11:08 that would certainly help, thank you.
6:11:10 - Anybody have any comments on the timeline?
6:11:13 - So the special dates that are outside
6:11:15 of our regular board meetings were April the 4th,
6:11:19 April the 18th, and then, and you’ve got a mark in both.
6:11:23 - Yes, ma’am. - May the 2nd.
6:11:26 - Yes, ma’am. - Okay.
6:11:27 And, oh, and then April the 27th and 28th, the interviews.
6:11:34 No, I mean, I think I had already looked at the calendar.
6:11:36 I think I’m good with those,
6:11:37 but when we had our conversation on the 9th,
6:11:42 or maybe it was previous to that,
6:11:43 we talked about having community meetings with finalists,
6:11:46 and I didn’t see that on there as part of,
6:11:49 that when we bring them in for interviews,
6:11:50 also having opportunities.
6:11:51 Is that still gonna be a part of the plan?
6:11:53 - Yes, ma’am, on April the 27th and 28th,
6:11:56 and what we typically would do,
6:11:58 the out-of-area candidates would arrive on April the 26th,
6:12:02 the evening of the 26th.
6:12:04 The 27th would be your day to interview
6:12:07 your three or four or five finalists as a sitting body.
6:12:11 That evening of the 27th,
6:12:14 we would then work with your staff and your superintendent
6:12:18 to identify an appropriate arena
6:12:20 for us to maybe have a community reception
6:12:24 where the community and employees
6:12:26 and everyone can come meet the finalists.
6:12:29 And then the next day, the 28th,
6:12:31 you would have your one-on-one interviews
6:12:35 following that evening reception.
6:12:37 And during the evening reception,
6:12:38 we’ll have an opportunity for people who attend
6:12:42 to access a QR code to provide their thoughts
6:12:45 on the candidates,
6:12:46 some comments they might have about each finalist.
6:12:50 We can compile that quickly
6:12:52 and have it to you the morning
6:12:54 that you go into your one-on-one interviews.
6:12:56 So some of that public input,
6:12:58 you may want to follow up with the finalists
6:13:01 as you interview them on that 28th.
6:13:05 - Thank you very much.
6:13:06 Ms. Campbell, did you have anything else?
6:13:08 - No, that’s good.
6:13:09 We talked about that and I liked it
6:13:10 and didn’t see it on there.
6:13:11 So I wanted to make sure that was still on the plan.
6:13:13 - Awesome.
6:13:14 Mr. Trent?
6:13:16 - And now, thank you for all the hard work
6:13:17 and let’s get going.
6:13:20 - Okay. - Okay, thank you.
6:13:21 - Ms. Wright?
6:13:22 - No, I don’t have anything to add.
6:13:23 - The one thing that I was gonna ask is
6:13:25 is that we had spoken before
6:13:26 about many of your school districts
6:13:28 in many parts of the United States are,
6:13:31 they don’t finish their schools until like June, right?
6:13:34 End of June, stuff like that.
6:13:36 We were talking, Dr. Schiller and I,
6:13:38 about this is an issue.
6:13:40 Do we need to put in there that in the event
6:13:41 that they would like to finish out their school year
6:13:44 so they don’t have to cut the last two months,
6:13:46 we could put in there that their start date may be later on?
6:13:49 Can we communicate that some way?
6:13:50 I didn’t want to miss that beat.
6:13:52 - Yes.
6:13:53 Once we’ve complete all of the community input
6:13:57 and also the survey results
6:13:59 and the board comes back on one of the dates here
6:14:03 to finalize the qualifications
6:14:05 and the qualities and characteristics
6:14:07 that are preferred in the next superintendent,
6:14:09 we can talk at that point about language.
6:14:12 In the advertisement, that might say something
6:14:14 about start date to be negotiable.
6:14:18 Typically, once the board sets the advertisement,
6:14:21 that’s where we put in any little oddities
6:14:23 about start dates, projected start dates, transition periods.
6:14:28 So we will certainly have that as an item to discuss
6:14:31 when we meet back on February 21st.
6:14:34 - Perfect.
6:14:35 - To finalize your advertisement.
6:14:36 - Awesome, thank you so much.
6:14:37 Okay, you had some more to do.
6:14:39 So what’s next?
6:14:39 What’s next?
6:14:40 - Thank you, we will move forward.
6:14:41 - I have a question.
6:14:42 - Oh, I’m sorry, Ms. Jenkins, go ahead.
6:14:45 - So this might be a little bit in the weeds here
6:14:47 with the timeline, but you guys had mentioned
6:14:49 that sometimes you have asked the candidates
6:14:51 to put together little videos
6:14:53 that we can release to the public,
6:14:55 kind of like little quick snapshots for people to look at
6:14:57 ‘cause I know being realistic here,
6:14:59 some people won’t attend those community forums,
6:15:01 some of them won’t watch the interviews
6:15:02 and things like that.
6:15:04 So where exactly would that happen in this process?
6:15:07 - That would come when you identify your semifinalists.
6:15:10 That would be on April the 24th,
6:15:14 once you identify your semifinalists.
6:15:16 And again, just for a number to talk about,
6:15:19 let’s say the board select six semifinalists
6:15:22 out of the total number of applicants.
6:15:24 We would then ask those six semifinalists
6:15:26 to respond to five questions,
6:15:28 one question from each board member.
6:15:31 Three of those responses, let’s say, would be video,
6:15:34 two would be written, so you get a feel
6:15:36 for their writing ability and their writing style.
6:15:40 And those videos and writing responses
6:15:43 would be displayed on your search portal as well.
6:15:51 - Thanks. - You’re welcome.
6:15:51 - Okay, moving forward.
6:15:53 - Yes, sir, on the surveys.
6:15:55 And again, I wanna commend Tammy for a great job she did
6:15:58 and also the board for completing
6:15:59 your homework assignments as well
6:16:02 and providing us with your input on each category.
6:16:05 If we can, I believe that Tammy has given you
6:16:08 a copy of the survey.
6:16:11 And if I could just look quickly
6:16:13 at the academic excellence area, the first section.
6:16:17 If you will note the first seven items
6:16:20 from the first top of that section,
6:16:22 three or more board members would like to have
6:16:26 those questions on the survey
6:16:28 or those items on the survey.
6:16:30 Out of the next, so we have seven in that first area.
6:16:35 Out of the next eight areas, each of the board members,
6:16:38 there are two board members that wanted those questions.
6:16:41 So what we would like to do since we have our first seven
6:16:44 down to the number 16, we need three from the next eight
6:16:49 to make it a total of 10 in each section.
6:16:52 Dr. Vogler and I have spent some time
6:16:54 looking at certainly your website.
6:16:56 We’ve looked at your strategic plan
6:16:58 and on some of the previous workshops
6:17:00 that we have worked with the board on,
6:17:02 we would recommend that after the first seven
6:17:06 that the survey would then add to that seven,
6:17:10 the number 10, which talks about
6:17:12 your early childhood programs,
6:17:14 number 11, the strategic plan,
6:17:17 and that number 12, improving student performance.
6:17:21 We would recommend those three be added to your top seven,
6:17:26 but certainly that’s up to the board
6:17:28 if you want to consider looking at another three to add.
6:17:33 - Are there any objections to–
6:17:34 - Can you say those three again?
6:17:35 - Yes, ma’am, right here.
6:17:36 You can see right there from there, these 10, 11.
6:17:39 - 10, 11, 12, okay.
6:17:40 - Any objections to his recommendation?
6:17:45 No? - No.
6:17:46 - No, all right.
6:17:47 You’re gonna go on that one. - Thank you, Mr. Sussan.
6:17:49 So for the first category,
6:17:50 it would be the first seven,
6:17:52 and we will add number 10, 11, and 12.
6:17:55 Moving forward to the Exceptional Workforce section,
6:17:58 again, the first seven have three or more board members
6:18:02 wanting those seven questions.
6:18:04 We would need then three out of the next four,
6:18:07 which had two board members for each of those four.
6:18:10 So we would recommend, again,
6:18:11 based on some of our research,
6:18:13 that we add number two, number 10, and number 16
6:18:17 to make that a total of 10 in that section.
6:18:21 Anybody object to his recommendations?
6:18:26 No?
6:18:27 I think, Ms. Jenkins, you good?
6:18:30 Okay, moving forward, we’re good.
6:18:31 - Thank you, moving forward
6:18:32 to the Community Connection section.
6:18:35 Again, the first seven had three or more board members,
6:18:38 so those are kind of locked in for those seven questions.
6:18:41 And out of the next seven,
6:18:42 which each of those statements had two board members
6:18:46 picking those, we would recommend,
6:18:48 based on some of our research,
6:18:50 would be number six, the collaboration with faculty,
6:18:53 community, in response to a diverse community
6:18:56 interest and needs.
6:18:58 And number seven, experience bringing
6:19:01 diverse special interest groups together.
6:19:03 And number 18, collaborating with your business partners.
6:19:07 So after the first seven, we would recommend
6:19:11 number six, number seven, and number 18.
6:19:21 Any objections to his recommendations?
6:19:26 Hearing none, I signify by you moving forward.
6:19:29 - Thank you.
6:19:30 With regard to operational sustainability,
6:19:34 there are eight that has three or more
6:19:37 of the board’s preference, so we certainly would go
6:19:39 with those first eight, meaning we would need two more
6:19:43 out of the next four, which had two board members
6:19:46 identifying those four.
6:19:48 And again, we would recommend that you add
6:19:50 to the first eight, number four and number 17.
6:19:58 - Okay.
6:20:00 - I wanted, there was one.
6:20:07 I’m fine with that, but there was one question,
6:20:09 can we edit it just so it’s more reflective
6:20:11 of what we have on the first, on number three?
6:20:14 On that page.
6:20:16 - Which section?
6:20:17 - It’s the fourth one.
6:20:18 It’s about operational sustainability, but number three,
6:20:19 it says including oversight of district police force.
6:20:22 Can we just change that to terminology
6:20:26 that would reflect what we have?
6:20:27 Maybe district security or.
6:20:31 - Okay, which one is that on?
6:20:34 - It’s number three.
6:20:35 - Under operational sustainability?
6:20:37 - Yeah.
6:20:38 - Okay.
6:20:38 - In the section we were just looking at.
6:20:40 It’s number three, it’s the bottom of that page.
6:20:42 - Yes, ma’am, and how would you like it to read?
6:20:45 - District security is probably good.
6:20:46 - District security, yeah.
6:20:48 ‘Cause we don’t call our district police force.
6:20:51 - Okay, okay.
6:20:57 Thank you, ma’am, we’ll make that change.
6:20:59 - Thank you.
6:21:00 - And our last item or last area
6:21:03 would be personal leadership qualities.
6:21:07 There were nine, the first nine items
6:21:09 had three more of the board identifying those areas.
6:21:12 So we need one of the next six
6:21:14 to make that total category 10.
6:21:18 And we would like to recommend you add number 14.
6:21:32 - Any objections to his recommendation?
6:21:35 - I just have a question.
6:21:37 So number 18, when it says,
6:21:39 has had multiple educational experiences.
6:21:43 I’m curious if I was interpreting that wrong,
6:21:45 and I just wanna know what you guys meant by that.
6:21:48 But I took that as in experiences in the educational field.
6:21:54 Is that not what you meant?
6:21:56 - Yes, it’s basically, it’s a candidate
6:22:00 that is not maybe just centered all on one academic area,
6:22:05 such as maybe ESE or facilities.
6:22:08 There was a variety of experiences
6:22:10 within the educational system
6:22:12 that that applicant would,
6:22:14 we would prefer the applicant to have
6:22:16 instead of maybe being centered into one area only.
6:22:22 - Can you remind me of the extra one you recommended?
6:22:24 Which one, that one was 14?
6:22:28 I mean, I’m not against that one,
6:22:29 but I just, the educational experience one is important.
6:22:34 - One of the things that I think we had spoken about before
6:22:37 was being able to allow a nontraditional candidate to apply.
6:22:42 Some of these, I don’t know how you word it,
6:22:43 because some of these are like specific to education
6:22:46 and stuff like that.
6:22:48 Somehow, in your great knowledge of how to do this process,
6:22:52 we just wanted to make sure
6:22:53 that that was something you guys planned on doing.
6:22:55 - Well, and we do address that
6:22:57 when the board comes back here to meet again,
6:22:59 we talk about the qualifications,
6:23:01 and qualities, and characteristics.
6:23:03 We address it at that point to talk about executive level
6:23:07 and comparable businesses,
6:23:09 or we have some language where it clearly kind of says
6:23:13 you can be an education career applicant,
6:23:15 or you could be a business applicant as well.
6:23:18 - Yep.
6:23:20 All right. - That’s what we can do.
6:23:21 - What else you got?
6:23:23 - That’s it, sir.
6:23:25 I would just like to say, too,
6:23:26 that what will happen with the survey now,
6:23:28 we’ll go back, we’ll kind of massage this
6:23:31 and update it this evening tonight.
6:23:33 I’ll provide it to Ms. Messina tomorrow,
6:23:36 and really within about a day or two days,
6:23:38 she will create the new survey now, our final survey.
6:23:42 She’ll provide your IT department with a gizmo link,
6:23:47 and also a link or a QR code
6:23:52 to access that survey from your site,
6:23:54 and we’ll be able to get the survey up and running
6:23:56 within two or three days.
6:23:58 - Okay.
6:23:59 Anybody else have any comments for our great search team?
6:24:04 No?
6:24:04 All right, I think we’re great. - Thank you, sir.
6:24:05 - Thank you so much for your time.
6:24:06 I appreciate it.
6:24:09 All right, what do we have next?
6:24:15 Then the other piece of the schedule stuff.
6:24:18 Just so you guys know, we had a situation where
6:24:23 many, so I feel that we are gonna have to move
6:24:27 towards coming in at nine o’clock
6:24:29 and some of these days to keep,
6:24:31 I feel that we may need some of these days
6:24:33 to come in at nine o’clock and move through.
6:24:34 We had a situation on February 7th that I was not aware of
6:24:38 that Ms. Campbell had brought forward to us
6:24:40 that she has got to go to,
6:24:42 she has her district responsibility
6:24:44 with the Children’s Hunger Project.
6:24:47 Based upon my knowledge of the direction that we were going,
6:24:50 I was concerned because we had so many things,
6:24:52 like policies and everything else.
6:24:54 What I would recommend to the board,
6:24:56 Ms. Campbell has said in communications
6:24:59 that she has responsibilities ahead of,
6:25:03 like she doesn’t just show up and speak,
6:25:05 like she’s trying to do things throughout the day.
6:25:07 So what I would like to do is make the recommendation
6:25:10 that we do come back at two o’clock,
6:25:13 not come in at nine o’clock in the morning,
6:25:15 come back at two o’clock ‘cause we don’t have now
6:25:18 all of the stuff that I thought we were gonna have.
6:25:20 And then in the event that we have a stacked agenda
6:25:22 to be respectful to her,
6:25:24 that we just roll it into our regular board meeting
6:25:26 and we might get out a little bit later,
6:25:28 but we at least respect her as an individual
6:25:30 for what she’s trying to do.
6:25:32 If you’re okay with that– - I’m okay with that,
6:25:34 and also three of you are attempting
6:25:36 to keep our USB-Ped.
6:25:37 - Yeah, and I think the idea was,
6:25:41 I thought the idea was, is look, if we had a big day,
6:25:43 we could come in at eight, leave at like 11,
6:25:45 ‘cause it’s right around the corner, right?
6:25:46 So that was part of the conversation.
6:25:48 But I think two things happened today.
6:25:50 One, we realized that we may not have the largest load
6:25:52 that we thought we had, and two, out of respect,
6:25:55 you know what I mean, that your responsibilities
6:25:57 at one of the best organizations that we have,
6:25:59 I think we just moved that way.
6:26:00 And look, we can stay a couple extra minutes
6:26:02 in the rest of the day and we can all go.
6:26:04 I would ask we all go, ‘cause I think
6:26:07 it’s such a great organization, and I’d like to–
6:26:08 - The invitation is still open.
6:26:09 And Dr. Shiller, I did not invite you
6:26:11 because we talked about the external, internal–
6:26:14 - Come on! - I don’t wanna send it to him.
6:26:16 - Let Dr. Shiller go.
6:26:18 He needs board direction. - Anyway, but–
6:26:20 (laughing)
6:26:21 - I just said– - Okay, oh, good, good.
6:26:23 I’ll get your email in a little bit, so.
6:26:25 We’re gonna feed ya.
6:26:27 I’ll touch base with you later. - It’s right around the corner.
6:26:29 Listen, you can sit in the back.
6:26:30 You’re gonna take care of it?
6:26:31 - Yeah, I will take care of it.
6:26:31 - All right, okay, you good?
6:26:33 Yeah, so is that right with you?
6:26:36 Could we move this conversation to now
6:26:37 since we have some time instead of tonight?
6:26:39 - Does everybody know what she’s about to bring up?
6:26:41 She’s bringing up the board communications
6:26:43 that we put together for when we were on the offsite
6:26:47 that we were all gonna sign.
6:26:49 I signed it, I think some other people have.
6:26:51 I don’t know who did, but I’m okay with talking about it.
6:26:54 Do we all have a copy somewhere,
6:26:55 or what are we working off of too?
6:26:58 ‘Cause you may start referring to stuff and they may not.
6:27:00 - I’m sure it’s on the agenda, right?
6:27:03 If you guys are able to pull it up on your computer.
6:27:06 Just that way we’re all prepared.
6:27:09 - Tammy, did you?
6:27:14 Yeah, she emailed it to us.
6:27:15 - Okay.
6:27:18 - It’s on the board agenda, is that correct?
6:27:20 - No, it’s not.
6:27:23 She’s sending it in an email.
6:27:29 - Anyways, if you wanna start speaking to it,
6:27:32 and then it’ll come in.
6:27:35 - I thought when we had our discussion on January 9th,
6:27:38 I haven’t gotten to go by your office, Tammy, to sign it,
6:27:42 but I thought we did good work
6:27:43 in going over what the expectations are.
6:27:46 It was really important for us to do that right at the start,
6:27:49 or not the very start, but as close to the start
6:27:51 as we could get considering all the things
6:27:53 that we’ve been doing over the last couple months.
6:27:55 There are a couple things that I just wanted to highlight
6:27:57 and remind because I think we’ve already gone
6:27:59 straight a little bit, and it’s so important
6:28:02 for us to work well together.
6:28:03 We’ve had some contention today,
6:28:05 and we were able, we’re working through it.
6:28:07 I mean, nobody stomped out of the room.
6:28:08 We’re all moving on to the next thing
6:28:11 for the good of the students, and I have no doubt
6:28:13 that every single one of us on this board
6:28:18 is here to do good things for children
6:28:21 and for our community.
6:28:23 But I wanted to just address a couple of things.
6:28:25 And I will just, I’m just gonna start through.
6:28:27 I’ve got, not going through the whole entire thing,
6:28:28 but hopefully you have it in front of you.
6:28:31 I will tell you that I did ask for this
6:28:34 because we had talked about when we wanted to address things,
6:28:36 try to put it, request it seven days early
6:28:38 and to put it on a work session.
6:28:40 So that’s why I’d actually request it
6:28:41 to be on a work session team and put it on the board meeting
6:28:43 but we have better time for our discussion here.
6:28:44 So I, that’s why I wanted to do it here.
6:28:49 I, skippy, skippy, skip to,
6:28:57 to page five.
6:29:01 There was, just something, I’m just gonna,
6:29:04 if anybody else wants in the discussion
6:29:06 to bring up things that they wanted to highlight,
6:29:08 just a reminder, I just wanted to bring this as a reminder
6:29:10 and then I am gonna address an issue that I’m having.
6:29:14 Number 10 says, “The focus of board meetings
6:29:16 “will be the work of the board
6:29:17 “and not administrative/staff work.”
6:29:20 And just to keep us focused, is it an item to celebrate?
6:29:22 Is it a policy decision?
6:29:24 Is it something that requires board action?
6:29:26 Is it needed to ensure accountability?
6:29:28 Does it align with the strategic plan?
6:29:31 There are some conversations that we’re starting to have
6:29:33 that we’ve already had that start to go over into staff
6:29:36 and I’m not, you know, listen, we,
6:29:38 staff is accountable to us through the superintendent
6:29:41 but we have a lot of really important work to do
6:29:47 and new board members, you are acclimating
6:29:49 as quickly as you can, policy manual.
6:29:52 This is E, on page five.
6:29:56 Number 10.
6:29:57 - Number 10.
6:29:58 - So I just wanna, I think we need to always be vigilant
6:30:01 to be careful of that line because unless we’re really
6:30:04 hearing an outcry from the public,
6:30:06 I think we need to be careful not to cross over
6:30:09 into the superintendent’s role.
6:30:11 Paul sent us, not very long ago, a statute
6:30:15 that describes the superintendent’s responsibility
6:30:18 by statute and of course, we’re gonna be talking about that
6:30:20 when we talk about our bylaws but, you know,
6:30:25 for me personally, and we can have this conversation later,
6:30:27 we do have it on the seventh but when we talk about
6:30:30 having the ESF staff all go out and sub,
6:30:34 to me, that’s an operational decision,
6:30:35 not a board policy decision and I think we need
6:30:38 to be careful of things like that.
6:30:40 If you wanna follow along with me, I’m going to page eight.
6:30:44 Page eight is section, Roman numeral two A
6:30:49 and number four, complaints received from staff
6:30:51 or the community will be directed
6:30:54 to the staff person best able to provide resolution
6:30:56 of the complaint or to the superintendent.
6:30:59 Number six says the board is the last stop
6:31:01 in the complaint process and number seven,
6:31:03 board members have no individual authority
6:31:05 to solve problems and number eight,
6:31:06 board members may ensure that complaints are addressed.
6:31:09 Now, believe me, when I say, number seven,
6:31:12 there’s a little bit of that that is true,
6:31:16 like solve problems, for example, I had somebody call me,
6:31:19 they didn’t know where to go, I’m like, you know,
6:31:21 I don’t need to send you to staff, I know,
6:31:23 let me just go to this place on the website.
6:31:25 I can, technically, I solved a problem,
6:31:27 I didn’t really solve a problem,
6:31:28 I just pointed them where to go.
6:31:29 I connected them with who they needed to talk to
6:31:31 but sometimes, if we start getting to the point
6:31:34 where people in the community can think that,
6:31:37 they can come to us and we’re gonna turn the system
6:31:40 upside down and have staff, as an individual board member,
6:31:43 not as a board, but as an individual board member
6:31:45 and then that’s how they get things done,
6:31:47 then they are going to start skipping over all the people
6:31:49 they really need to be communicating with
6:31:51 to build relationships, the teacher, the principal,
6:31:55 directors, above that and working itself up the chain.
6:31:58 I am all for and I have encouraged people all the time,
6:32:01 if you come in complaining and you said,
6:32:02 you tried to reach out to the teacher,
6:32:03 the teacher wouldn’t listen,
6:32:04 means you tried to talk to the principal
6:32:06 and the principal wouldn’t listen,
6:32:07 I’m happy to direct you to our assistant superintendents
6:32:10 but when we start taking those as board members
6:32:13 and we say, you know what, I’m gonna fix it for you,
6:32:17 that is not the way we’re supposed to operate.
6:32:22 And going right along that on the next page on number nine,
6:32:27 the agreements that we agreed to
6:32:28 between the board and superintendent nine,
6:32:30 we have Roman number one A and number four,
6:32:32 it says encourage outreach to staff.
6:32:35 While the board is eager to listen to its constituents
6:32:37 and staff, each inquiry is to be referred to the person
6:32:40 who can properly and expeditiously address the issue.
6:32:44 Board requests that will likely require considerable time
6:32:47 or have political implications
6:32:48 or be directed to the superintendent.
6:32:51 All personnel complaints and criticisms
6:32:53 received by the board or its individual members
6:32:55 will be directed to the superintendent and/or designee.
6:32:58 And in other words, it’s never for us
6:33:00 to go crawl down a staff member’s case
6:33:03 because they didn’t do what we wanted them to do.
6:33:06 If they didn’t do what we wanted to do and we have a problem,
6:33:08 that’s the person that we go to and say,
6:33:10 you know what, I heard about this situation,
6:33:13 this is what happened and there, go take care of it
6:33:16 ‘cause they answer to him.
6:33:18 He answers to us, but they answer to him.
6:33:20 So we need to be careful of that.
6:33:22 On page 10, number 10, utilize CEO input.
6:33:27 We’ve done a lot of that today.
6:33:28 The superintendent is the CEO of the senior leadership team
6:33:31 and should make recommendations, proposals, or suggestions
6:33:33 on most matters that come before the board.
6:33:35 There are, of course, times that it really
6:33:37 is just up to the board.
6:33:38 For example, when we do our public comment policy,
6:33:40 when we get ready to go out to that,
6:33:42 that’s not really, the superintendent doesn’t really
6:33:43 have a lot of input into that.
6:33:44 That’s the board, that’s how we run our meetings.
6:33:46 But on most of the things, we need to listen
6:33:49 to those recommendations.
6:33:50 I mean, we have to take ‘em, but we need
6:33:51 to get those recommendations.
6:33:53 And then number 11, the board acts only as a body.
6:33:58 Individual board members do not have authority.
6:34:02 Only the board as a whole has authority.
6:34:04 We agree that an individual board member
6:34:07 will not take unilateral action.
6:34:09 The board chairperson will communicate the position
6:34:12 or positions of the board on controversial issues.
6:34:15 And then board members serve on various school committees,
6:34:17 their role, so it would be defined on the board
6:34:19 as silent observer or active participant,
6:34:21 and those are all those committees that we’ve decided.
6:34:24 I want to pull up, because a lot of these things
6:34:28 came from our bylaws, which are still in place,
6:34:35 and bylaw 0149.1 talks about public expression of members,
6:34:41 and I’m just gonna read from the third paragraph.
6:34:43 It says board members should, when speaking, excuse me,
6:34:46 when writing or speaking on school matters to the media,
6:34:50 legislators, and other officials make it clear
6:34:53 that their views do not necessarily reflect
6:34:56 the views of the board or of their colleagues on the board.
6:35:00 And that would be unless it’s something
6:35:02 that we have all agreed to.
6:35:04 And I’m gonna come back to that in just a minute.
6:35:06 Page 11.
6:35:11 And number 12 first, number 12.
6:35:14 We will not react to impromptu complaints on the spot,
6:35:17 but we’ll assure any individuals
6:35:18 that the district will follow up.
6:35:20 That’s talking about during meetings.
6:35:21 We just need to be careful.
6:35:22 Sometimes people come and do public comment,
6:35:25 and it’s moving, it’s stirring, right?
6:35:27 But we haven’t heard all the side,
6:35:29 and so that’s why we don’t react on the spot
6:35:31 and say we’re gonna fix that.
6:35:32 But we just say, you know what?
6:35:34 We’re gonna make sure we follow up,
6:35:36 but it’s our time to listen.
6:35:38 It’s not always our time to address.
6:35:40 I’ll be honest and say number 13 I’m gonna mention
6:35:42 about the marathon board meetings
6:35:43 because I know we have a lot to go through,
6:35:46 but I will just be completely honest
6:35:47 is starting in the morning at nine
6:35:49 and not sometimes ending until nine.
6:35:51 I think it’s too much,
6:35:52 and I don’t wanna become a regular practice.
6:35:53 And listen, I have sat through the record board meetings.
6:35:56 When we were going through COVID,
6:35:57 we had two meetings that were over 11 hours.
6:36:00 We started at nine in the morning or 9.30,
6:36:02 and we didn’t get done till 8.30, one and 8.15, the other.
6:36:06 And it had to be done ‘cause it was COVID.
6:36:09 We don’t ever wanna do it again.
6:36:10 And it’s not just a matter of time
6:36:12 and I’ve got laundry to do or shopping to do.
6:36:14 We, the emotional and mental drain of being on camera
6:36:20 and gotta be on your game,
6:36:22 having your wits together about you,
6:36:25 we’ve got to be at our best.
6:36:26 And I don’t think we need to have regular practices
6:36:28 of having meetings where we start.
6:36:30 And I know there are districts, Miami-Dade’s one of ‘em,
6:36:32 where they start early and they go all day
6:36:33 and it’s just what they do.
6:36:34 But it’s not, I don’t think it’s the best.
6:36:37 And we’ve talked about marathon board meetings
6:36:38 to be efficient and effective.
6:36:40 Long board meetings must be avoided.
6:36:42 And so in the future, and when the,
6:36:47 so here are, here are some of the problems that I’ve had.
6:36:53 And this is why I’m bringing this up.
6:36:56 Yesterday we received an email that was going to change
6:36:59 and I appreciate that we’re changing it.
6:37:00 And I appreciate that you recognize that it’s,
6:37:03 you know, it’s because of what I am doing,
6:37:06 serving on the board of the Children’s Hunger Project
6:37:07 and getting prepared for the luncheon
6:37:08 that I’d already invited everybody to
6:37:10 that was on the calendar.
6:37:12 But we didn’t even, we didn’t discuss it.
6:37:14 We weren’t asked, we just got an email that said
6:37:17 on February 7th, we’re starting at nine.
6:37:19 Our practice has been, and I’ve looked through the bylaws,
6:37:22 I don’t, you know, the bylaws and the role of the chair
6:37:25 don’t say that the chair gets to pick the start times.
6:37:28 I don’t believe.
6:37:29 But what we have done in the past,
6:37:33 just out of practicality, out of respect,
6:37:35 out of professionalism, we’ve come together.
6:37:38 And we were having this meeting today
6:37:40 where we could have discussed it.
6:37:41 Hey, we’ve had done, hey, board,
6:37:44 either the superintendent’s told us
6:37:45 or we’ve talked about it as a board,
6:37:46 hey, we’ve got a lot coming up at the next meeting.
6:37:48 Can we start at one, can we do it a little bit earlier,
6:37:50 can we plan an extra meeting?
6:37:51 And we discussed that and we do it collaboratively.
6:37:53 We don’t just ask Tammy to send it out and do that.
6:37:56 And so Mr. Chair, that was very frustrating to me
6:37:59 and I don’t think it honored the rest of the board
6:38:02 by just unilaterally making that scheduling decision.
6:38:07 And like I said, I appreciate that we went around it
6:38:09 but I honestly don’t think it should have been done
6:38:10 that way to begin with.
6:38:11 And I’m gonna go back to this that I said
6:38:15 about individual board members taking unilateral action.
6:38:19 On the day that we worked through this
6:38:22 and we came to some concurrence
6:38:23 and to a document that we all agreed to sign and abide by,
6:38:28 and again, this is what we talked about,
6:38:29 this is a gentleman’s agreement,
6:38:30 this is a commitment we make to one another
6:38:32 out of respect and professionalism
6:38:33 and because this is the best way that this team works.
6:38:36 Not because somebody’s gonna slap somebody’s hand
6:38:38 if they don’t do it or that somebody’s gonna get,
6:38:41 you know, kicked off the board.
6:38:42 That’s not the way that it works
6:38:43 but it’s our agreements that we make to one another.
6:38:46 On the same day that we made this decision,
6:38:48 we also talked about our legislative priorities
6:38:50 because on two days later, on Wednesday of that same week,
6:38:53 we were gonna ask the chair
6:38:55 to present to the legislative delegation
6:38:57 what our priorities were.
6:38:59 We had some already listed and we talked about a few more.
6:39:01 We talked about FRS, we talked about wage compression,
6:39:05 we talked about, Ms. Wright, you brought up a couple things
6:39:10 that we weren’t quite sure if we were gonna add,
6:39:11 we weren’t quite comfortable adding those
6:39:12 but we talked about that.
6:39:13 We talked about pre-K and classroom teachers
6:39:17 which had gotten left off, we wanted to put that back on.
6:39:20 I was, I didn’t get to attend
6:39:24 the legislative delegation meeting
6:39:25 ‘cause I was on my way to Tampa but I listened in
6:39:27 and I finished it up over the next couple of days.
6:39:29 I was shocked to listen, Mr. Chairman,
6:39:36 to your presentation to the legislative delegation
6:39:40 because in addition to the things that we had talked about
6:39:42 that we agreed on and that you were speaking
6:39:46 to the legislative delegation as our representative,
6:39:49 as a representative of this board,
6:39:52 in addition to that, you said some things
6:39:55 as if they were agreed upon, as if they were done deals
6:39:59 and I was so shocked, I actually had to go back
6:40:01 and I actually had to type verbatim what you said
6:40:04 because I’m, no, no, he didn’t say that, he didn’t say that
6:40:05 and you did say that.
6:40:07 - Ms. Campbell, like this is part of what we have
6:40:08 inside of this governance is able to defend yourself
6:40:13 in as far as stuff, right?
6:40:14 - I’m gonna give you the chance.
6:40:15 - But no, you’re actually not, you’re bringing this up.
6:40:18 What we did agree to is, is that we agreed
6:40:20 to a policy procedure where seven days prior,
6:40:23 somebody would bring together the things, right?
6:40:25 - That’s what I, that’s why I’m bringing this up.
6:40:27 That’s why I said, I’m gonna look through this.
6:40:29 I wanted everybody to review this before this discussion.
6:40:31 - Ms. Campbell, Ms. Campbell, if you have these issues
6:40:34 which are a litany of these things,
6:40:36 please send an email to me over each one of these things
6:40:39 so that I can be prepared to explain back
6:40:42 because a lot of what you’re saying, I have answers to,
6:40:45 but I, like, it would help me if I was prepared.
6:40:48 I can’t, I can’t–
6:40:50 - Well, Mr. Susan, you said these on a televised meeting
6:40:54 and again, I read this particular policy
6:40:58 because it even said specifically, speaking to legislators,
6:41:01 you said that we were looking at expanding
6:41:04 firefighter academies into two more areas
6:41:06 around Rockledge and into Titusville
6:41:08 when we have not done any such thing.
6:41:11 You mentioned it that day when we were having
6:41:12 a conversation with FSBA.
6:41:14 You did your thank yous, you talked about the things
6:41:17 that we did talk about with aquaculture program
6:41:19 and the carpentry program, counselors, media specialists
6:41:22 and all that and you added in the adult ed CDL program
6:41:25 that, but then you said, you told them about
6:41:29 what we talked about at our meeting at the zoo that Monday.
6:41:32 You said the board made significant commitments
6:41:34 to the community and you talked about how we were going
6:41:39 and I don’t necessarily disagree with all of these,
6:41:41 we said we’re going to publish our budget online
6:41:43 for expenditures above $500.
6:41:44 I don’t ever actually remember having that conversation.
6:41:47 You said we’re going to allow homeschool students
6:41:49 to take one or two classes and do an attraction campaign.
6:41:52 Homeschool students have always been able to take,
6:41:54 by the way, one or two classes and even more.
6:41:56 That’s not a new thing and you said we’re going
6:41:58 to do a parental and volunteer expansion program
6:42:00 and that we’d met with Health First and Brevard Zoo.
6:42:02 When you asked them to speak to us,
6:42:04 you didn’t tell us what it was about.
6:42:06 All of a sudden it was just happening
6:42:08 and you’re saying they’re gonna give us their stuff
6:42:09 and we’re going to do it.
6:42:10 These are not conversations that we had as a board
6:42:14 but yet you took that time when you were supposed
6:42:15 to be sharing our legislative delegation priorities
6:42:20 and you presented an agenda that was not our agenda
6:42:23 so I can only assume it was your agenda
6:42:25 and because those were each things that you brought up
6:42:27 on the meeting on that Monday,
6:42:29 it was very frustrating to me because in that moment,
6:42:31 you were representing us as a board
6:42:34 but you did not represent the 480,000 people
6:42:40 that the other four of us represent
6:42:42 when you unilaterally made those decisions
6:42:45 and so because it was a publicly televised meeting
6:42:49 and now the county of Brevard and our legislators think
6:42:52 that we’re doing all these things and we haven’t had
6:42:54 those conversations yet, yes, I’m not slapping you on the hand
6:42:58 we’re not kicking off the board
6:42:59 but you didn’t follow the agreements that we made.
6:43:05 - Okay, so Ms. Campbell, I would have appreciated
6:43:07 because inside of this document, there are other items
6:43:09 that say that we’re supposed to bring these things forward
6:43:11 so that somebody can actually sit here and put it together
6:43:14 and have a defense, hang on.
6:43:16 The other thing is we haven’t even signed
6:43:17 the document together.
6:43:18 We haven’t officially brought it forward,
6:43:20 we haven’t officially done all those things.
6:43:22 So there’s a lot here that you’re making allegations to
6:43:26 that I started writing down but it’s not fair for somebody
6:43:29 to come forward with all of these allegations
6:43:31 and not sit there and say,
6:43:33 “Hey, I’m gonna bring these things forward.
6:43:35 “I would like you to be able to respond.”
6:43:37 It goes against everything that we discussed that day.
6:43:39 It goes against the actual governance that you put in there
6:43:42 and it puts us liable to allow other individuals
6:43:44 to just pop off which they did already today
6:43:47 about a situation that we shouldn’t be doing.
6:43:49 Let’s work towards a goal as far as sign this document,
6:43:53 work towards those as goals but at the same time,
6:43:56 let’s not pop off and hit somebody like this
6:43:58 because that’s not fair.
6:43:59 I will take the time to go through this and look at it
6:44:02 and I’ll come back to you at the next workshop
6:44:05 and talk about it but I think that it’s unfair
6:44:07 to make accusations across the table
6:44:09 without an opportunity to defend myself.
6:44:11 I did wanna also– - Well, I can appreciate that.
6:44:12 - Hang on a second, hang on a second.
6:44:13 I also wanted to say one thing.
6:44:15 One of the issues that we have is that there’s a board
6:44:18 governance process that we wanna put together, right?
6:44:21 The other thing is is that the district school board
6:44:23 in accordance with the provisions of 4B article nine
6:44:25 of the state constitution, district school board
6:44:27 shall operate, control and supervise all public schools
6:44:32 in their respective districts and may exercise any power
6:44:35 except expressly prohibited by the state constitution
6:44:38 or general law, that is our bylaws, that is who we are.
6:44:41 And sometimes some of these things is a process
6:44:45 but things happen where we’ve got to make a decision
6:44:48 and move forward, okay?
6:44:49 So I’ll answer your stuff but I’d appreciate it
6:44:51 in the future if you would respectfully follow
6:44:54 the board governance that you actually are referring to
6:44:57 and allow us to have the time ahead of time, that’s it.
6:44:59 - So that is why I asked for it to be put
6:45:02 on the work session seven days in advance, this.
6:45:06 Now I did not specifically list, you’re right Mr. Susan
6:45:08 and I’ll give you that, I did not in my request
6:45:11 to put it on the work session say because I’m going
6:45:13 to talk about how Mr. Susan did this and Mr. Susan did that
6:45:15 and if I need to do that then I will do that next time,
6:45:18 I will do that but I will tell you,
6:45:19 I didn’t do a public records request,
6:45:22 I didn’t go behind your back,
6:45:23 I watched a publicly televised meeting
6:45:25 and you said things that are not things that we agreed on,
6:45:28 that you just, you said things that were brought up in–
6:45:30 - I said things that are both happening inside
6:45:32 of our district and that we had communicated
6:45:34 were priorities for our school board, that’s it.
6:45:37 So I can look back at all of those
6:45:40 but prior to me saying those on there,
6:45:42 Russell Broom presented me with a speech
6:45:44 and those, I will go back and look at it
6:45:46 but to come at me and attack me here
6:45:48 when I haven’t had a defense,
6:45:49 I didn’t even know it was coming in a situation
6:45:52 I think is disingenuous, so I’ll refer back to it.
6:45:54 - Well I didn’t know what you said was coming either
6:45:56 and neither did the rest of the board to my knowledge.
6:46:00 - Okay, anybody else have anything
6:46:03 that they want to discuss?
6:46:05 - I do.
6:46:07 So first off, individuals popping off,
6:46:12 yep, I’m an elected school board member,
6:46:14 get to say what I want to say.
6:46:15 Sorry Mr. Susan, I thought that upset you.
6:46:18 I went ahead and requested to have this conversation
6:46:23 at the workshop through Tammy yesterday,
6:46:26 again, to appease your request
6:46:30 for it to not be at the regular board meetings.
6:46:32 So nope, you didn’t get ahead to that.
6:46:34 - The request that you made was for something
6:46:36 that we just need clarification on.
6:46:38 - No, Mr. Susan, you don’t get to say what my request is.
6:46:41 No, Mr. Susan, I am speaking.
6:46:43 Thank you very much, sir.
6:46:45 You don’t know what my request is.
6:46:47 - Go ahead, Ms. Jenkins, go ahead.
6:46:48 - Thank you.
6:46:51 So I wanted to get a follow-up
6:46:53 because on November 22nd when I presented
6:46:57 that we have a new procedure
6:46:59 which you also clarified again on December 8th,
6:47:04 when a board member does a public records request
6:47:06 of another board member,
6:47:08 it goes to an outside counsel that we are paying for.
6:47:12 And on December 8th, you said to the board as a whole
6:47:17 that the reason that decision was made,
6:47:19 because I made a request and I received
6:47:21 three months worth of text messages
6:47:22 that I should have never received.
6:47:24 I don’t have those text messages.
6:47:26 So you told me you would follow up
6:47:28 and explain what I received that was too broad.
6:47:32 I still have yet to know what that was
6:47:34 because that’s justifying us spending hundreds of dollars
6:47:37 to a lawyer because simply a board member
6:47:39 is requesting something from a board member.
6:47:41 I think we deserve to know the why
6:47:43 ‘cause I genuinely don’t understand the why behind that.
6:47:46 And I’ve said that again too.
6:47:47 A member of the public can ask
6:47:48 for the exact same thing I’m asking for
6:47:50 and it’s not gonna cost the district any money.
6:47:52 It doesn’t make any sense.
6:47:53 My other follow-up question is on November 22nd,
6:47:58 because you believe that business
6:48:00 done on a personal phone call
6:48:02 does not constitute a public record
6:48:04 and you are challenging that idea,
6:48:06 you requested us to reach out
6:48:08 to the attorney general for an opinion.
6:48:11 My question is, it is now January 24th,
6:48:15 Mr. Gibbs, where are we on reaching out
6:48:18 to the attorney general for an opinion
6:48:20 if board business is done on your personal cell phone?
6:48:25 - We have worked with our outside council
6:48:27 that was hired by Dr. Mullins
6:48:29 to do the board member public records.
6:48:32 They’ve put together the letter,
6:48:34 I’ve shared it with the chair
6:48:35 to see if he was in agreement with what’s in there.
6:48:39 We have come up with an issue
6:48:41 and I was gonna brief the board probably later this week.
6:48:44 On the issue is the attorney’s contacted me
6:48:47 and said he doesn’t believe we can sign the certification
6:48:51 that is required as part of the AGO process
6:48:55 where you have to certify there is no ongoing litigation
6:48:58 regarding the matter.
6:48:59 So that issue may prevent us from being able
6:49:01 to get an AGO on that particular issue
6:49:04 because as we had mentioned on I believe November,
6:49:06 there is the DeSantis case
6:49:08 where the public records issues are wrapped into that case
6:49:11 and the AGO’s office typically will not render an opinion
6:49:15 if there’s ongoing litigation.
6:49:17 So we may be precluded from getting an AGO
6:49:20 on that issue right now.
6:49:21 - Mr. Gibbs, did I ask you,
6:49:23 could I give you direction and give you information
6:49:26 on all this earlier? - Mr. Gibbs, my question is,
6:49:27 when did the chair receive that letter that you drafted?
6:49:31 Like what has been happening?
6:49:33 Why has it been taking this long?
6:49:35 - I don’t remember the date that I forwarded it to him.
6:49:38 We’ve been doing other board business
6:49:40 and we were closed down for two weeks, so.
6:49:43 - Okay, do you need these answers?
6:49:46 - So I would like those answers
6:49:48 but I just want to clarify again,
6:49:50 these are conversations that can’t happen off of the dais.
6:49:53 They have to happen in the sunshine.
6:49:55 So you call it popping off
6:49:56 but it has to happen here.
6:49:58 There’s no other place for me to hold these conversations.
6:50:01 And these conversations happened in front of the public.
6:50:04 So we should be following up with them.
6:50:08 - All right, so the first one is the why.
6:50:11 All right, so just so that it’s been discussed,
6:50:14 the why that we have moved towards
6:50:15 the public records requests being handled
6:50:17 by an outside council was because of the overabundance
6:50:21 of public records requests by Ms. Jenkins
6:50:24 that then was putting staff in a bad situation
6:50:27 because there was an overbearing of requests.
6:50:30 And then on top of that,
6:50:32 there was a basic staff felt uncomfortable
6:50:36 by the way that these things were happening.
6:50:38 There’s multiple emails to the point where Dr. Mullins
6:50:42 decided to not have staff in between
6:50:45 to squaring off board members,
6:50:47 which puts them in a bad spot to move to outside council.
6:50:50 So the why is is because of the overabundance
6:50:53 and putting board members,
6:50:55 putting staff in between two board members.
6:50:56 That’s the first one.
6:50:58 The cost is very easy to figure out.
6:51:03 So the cost when somebody makes a public records request
6:51:05 for everything that that public records request,
6:51:07 if you are a person from the public, is a charge.
6:51:11 That is a charge to pull somebody’s public records,
6:51:13 that’s somebody to pull their cell phones,
6:51:14 their texts, their emails, whatever that is.
6:51:17 That is the cost is inhibited also
6:51:20 because now we have to go to an outside council
6:51:22 so that we don’t put board to board
6:51:24 and staff in the middle of this.
6:51:26 There are emails supporting this
6:51:29 that our staff felt it was imperative
6:51:32 to move to an outside council.
6:51:34 And that’s what ended up happening for that.
6:51:36 The cost is $325 per hour that the outside council
6:51:41 is supposed to cover for doing this process.
6:51:46 And on top of that,
6:51:48 I feel that there should also be a cost attributed
6:51:51 because when a staff member inside of our school district
6:51:54 gives their cost based upon how many hours
6:51:57 they have to work, we as school board members are paid.
6:52:00 So it would make sense that we as a school board member
6:52:03 also charge for it to happen
6:52:05 because we are spending our time to do it.
6:52:08 It’s an outside cost.
6:52:09 So businesses to public record, the attorney general issue.
6:52:14 The attorney general issue, and I had no idea, again,
6:52:17 any of this was gonna come up.
6:52:18 I didn’t know that this was conversation.
6:52:20 I didn’t know that these were accusations.
6:52:22 I would appreciate– - I brought it up
6:52:23 to Mr. Gibbs yesterday, he told you.
6:52:24 - Listen, no, actually he had not given me
6:52:27 all of these topics.
6:52:29 You had somehow last night made a request
6:52:32 to put this on the board agenda,
6:52:34 and then at the last minute I said,
6:52:35 can you just give some clarification, which never came.
6:52:38 So Paul did not call me last night to tell me all of this.
6:52:41 That is incorrect.
6:52:42 But the reason that we moved to the attorney general
6:52:44 was because it seemed like that was the appropriate place.
6:52:47 But the attorney general doesn’t have
6:52:48 any literal case law to work off of.
6:52:51 But if you remember, the one thing that we said
6:52:53 was that there’s a current case
6:52:55 that is defining portions of this
6:52:57 that is more appropriate for us to wait on.
6:53:00 Ms. Jenkins, I would also remind you
6:53:01 that you have other public records requests
6:53:03 out there in other areas that you have been told
6:53:07 that public records requests for personal call logs
6:53:09 are not actual public records.
6:53:12 And this is a sticky area that I feel
6:53:14 that staff has been put in between.
6:53:16 So going to outside counsel to administer them
6:53:19 and going out and waiting for an actual judicial opinion
6:53:22 is part of what we’re doing.
6:53:24 We gave board direction to do that.
6:53:26 And there’s just a ton of other stuff here
6:53:30 that’s just, it’s in there.
6:53:31 So, and oh, the thing where you said three months worth,
6:53:35 I have the email.
6:53:36 I told Paul, I said, hey, whatever it is that she,
6:53:39 and he said, that was your one issue,
6:53:41 that you were concerned that there was three months of,
6:53:43 and I needed, you wanted that email.
6:53:45 So I said, by the end of the day,
6:53:46 before we get to the board meeting,
6:53:48 I’ll find it and I’ll give it to you.
6:53:50 But obviously Paul did not go to you
6:53:52 and say that that’s what he was gonna do.
6:53:54 So that’s my answer to everything, which makes sense.
6:54:01 This process has been an overabundance of public records
6:54:04 to try to create these narratives that don’t exist.
6:54:06 And to be honest with you, I have no problem if you said,
6:54:10 here’s what I’m thinking you’re doing,
6:54:11 then I don’t mind ever saying,
6:54:13 this is not true because of this.
6:54:15 There was one that said that I was the one
6:54:17 that had something to do with some of these issues,
6:54:19 that they’re just not true.
6:54:20 And I would love to have you say,
6:54:22 this is what I’m concerned about,
6:54:23 and me say, okay, I’ll answer it.
6:54:25 But it has to be in an area
6:54:26 that you’re not just bringing it forward
6:54:28 to the school board meeting,
6:54:29 throwing it down and having a conversation.
6:54:31 It’s disingenuous.
6:54:32 And it goes against the governance that we’re signing today.
6:54:36 - Are you finished?
6:54:37 - Yeah, I’m done.
6:54:38 I think we’re done with the meeting.
6:54:39 - No, we’re not.
6:54:40 You can’t just end that meeting there, sorry.
6:54:42 - So I understand that you would like me to just say that
6:54:46 and for me to take your word,
6:54:48 but I am not only just a board member,
6:54:49 I’m also a private citizen of Brevard,
6:54:52 and it is the law that you are under public records
6:54:56 and open government.
6:54:57 - Absolutely. - An overbearance of requests.
6:55:00 Mr. Susan, I’ve used my own personal name
6:55:03 to make these requests.
6:55:04 I’m not ashamed of them.
6:55:05 At this point now, I have made 12 in six months.
6:55:09 Yes, I have, 12 in six months.
6:55:11 And when you say that the reason it went to outside counsel
6:55:14 is because of the overbearance, that is not truthful.
6:55:18 And at our last board meeting at Brevard Zoo,
6:55:21 you told everyone here that it was made
6:55:23 because someone had messed up and responded too broadly to me
6:55:27 and gave you three months worth of text messages.
6:55:29 That is the statement that you made.
6:55:32 Not true.
6:55:32 - Among other things.
6:55:33 - Now I will say, Mr. Gibbs,
6:55:34 didn’t just tell me about an hour ago
6:55:36 that you had said you were gonna send me that email,
6:55:38 which you did say back in that meeting at Brevard Zoo,
6:55:40 and I’ve yet to have it.
6:55:41 So I’ll wait to see it.
6:55:42 The fact that we are paying an outside counsel $325 an hour
6:55:46 simply because I am the individual requesting the data
6:55:49 is absurd, and I care enough about our budget
6:55:52 that I’m just gonna ask somebody else to do it from now on,
6:55:54 ‘cause it doesn’t make any sense.
6:55:56 It makes zero sense.
6:55:57 I’m being transparent, putting my name on that document.
6:56:00 Not ashamed of it.
6:56:05 When you make a statement that I’ve already been told
6:56:07 by outside agencies that I’ve made these requests previously
6:56:10 that it’s not subject to public record,
6:56:13 man, that’s really interesting
6:56:17 ‘cause I know who told you that.
6:56:19 And it has absolutely nothing to do
6:56:21 with the requests that I make.
6:56:23 It has nothing to do with that.
6:56:25 And we went and we asked an outside counsel opinion
6:56:29 to draft an opinion already.
6:56:31 We called the Attorney General’s office.
6:56:33 We spoke to Pat Gleason,
6:56:34 who writes the handbook for public records,
6:56:37 and she recommended a lawyer to draft an opinion.
6:56:39 You didn’t like that opinion.
6:56:41 - Pat also said that we needed to go to the–
6:56:41 - And then you asked for us to write a letter
6:56:43 to the Attorney General, and you sat on it.
6:56:46 And that is my point of bringing it up today
6:56:49 because the public has a right to know.
6:56:52 - Thank you, Ms. Jenkins.
6:56:53 I would also say that Ms. Gleason is the one
6:56:54 that also said that we should follow the DeSantis case.
6:56:56 - No, she did not, I called myself.
6:56:57 - Yes, she did, and she’s also,
6:56:59 you have been told by multiple attorneys that that is not,
6:57:02 and I have submitted all, except for the most recent ones,
6:57:05 all of the personal cell phone texts
6:57:07 and stuff that pertain to it,
6:57:09 and I have followed to the letter.
6:57:10 And so now we are in the process of waiting
6:57:12 for the DeSantis campaign on the other piece,
6:57:15 and that’s it. - I have received
6:57:15 zero documents from your personal cell phone.
6:57:17 - That is not true either.
6:57:18 That is not true either.
6:57:19 I’ll submit all of those to you by the end of the day.
6:57:22 Thank you very much.
6:57:23 (gavel bangs)